Supporters Forum
Rob K - March 16, 2005

Dear Forum - I am very sad to have to say that my wonderful cousin Steve Gleiber, host of the forum, passed away a few hours ago. Stevie was only 41 years old but has finally lost his battle with cancer. He is survived by his loving family Jutka, Janche & Susie and his wonderful partner Angela. 

He was a big guy with a bigger heart. Even though he lived in Sydney, and we, his maternal family, live in the UK he was always a large part of all of our lives and we loved him dearly. He loved his family & partner, life & Arsenal passionately. I miss him already...

Note: A memorial page has been created HERE

Adverts/services (including ripping off genuine supporters with astronomically priced ticket offers) posted to this forum will be removed IMMEDIATELY. The same goes for abusive messages. 
If you have a product or service that you feel is relevant to Arsenal supporters then contact us and we can discuss it. If you have a problem or a question for me, then contact us 
DON'T post it here it. If you want to post rumours, then use the Rumours Page and not this one. 
This is NOT a joke/windup page.

POSTINGS:


Bernard
April 07, 2005
babu, so what if he's had a few affairs. So did Princess Diana and it didn't put many people off her. And in what way is he so corrupt, because being wealthy and influential is not necessarily the same thing. And why are Bayern Munich evil at all, albeit you think less so than Chelsea. To me the term hysterical nonsense seems a fitting description of what you're saying about Beckenbauer and Bayern.


babu
April 07, 2005
And Cannon Balls...I hope bayern win tonight, for the GOOD of football, better to have the lesser of two evils.


babu
April 07, 2005
bernard...morally he had a very public affair, and a few not public ones,and he is Mr. Corrupt, and he is really doing very nicely for himself.He is VERY biased towards bayern, which I guess I would be if in the same position for Arsenal, but I am not, so I suggest taking a person who has not been so biased in his dealings in his country, as I suggest that if he were dealing with world events then he would be biased towards germany. Admittedly I don't know how he could influence anything, but I am sure if there's a will there's a way, and he would be willing to do anything for his own ends.


Cannon Balls
April 07, 2005
Babu,that may be true what you say - but all of this came about because Chelsea are playing BM; and some of their supporters like GunGun are trying to tie in the Kaiser v Platini issue into the match issue by claiming that Chelsea need to win for the good of football.Total nonsense!.The two events have no connection.


Bernard
April 07, 2005
babu, what is it that makes him such a bad person?


babu
April 07, 2005
tom dean...you're really cool. Can I be your friend ??


babu
April 07, 2005
Cannon Balls...Blatter is swiss, for one, and he is a real bastard, unfortunately. Corruption is alive and well, and the swiss are a major part of this. How do you think they got the next euro. championships with austria ??? And now they only have 3 stadiums that are suitable, as the Zuerich Stadium got thrown out by the people, although one of the requirements was for 4 stadiums suitable to play the finals.Unfortunately I agree with the conspiratory theory, the kaiser (written with a small k on purpose) is really a very bad person, in his private life and in his football world. Platini on the other hand I think is a lot better, and definetly preferable to that kraut.


Parkerknoll Gooner
April 07, 2005
I think Toms finding it hard to come to terms with the fact he's not the only Gay in the chelsea village!


Cannon Balls
April 07, 2005
Once years ago i inadvertaintly accepted the offer of a ride back to London on a coach full of Jevovah's Witnesses from the West Country after my car broke down. And from the experience i drew the conclusion that the only way that you ever get a group of people to all agree on something is to brain-wash them into believing it. Old GunGun the main, 'lets all be friends and love Chelsea because they are doing no harm guys', is himself a serial abuser - throwing insults around, particularly at me for some unknown reason on this forum. That is not a problem to me,only the stupidity of his posts, which he insists on keep posting to me about Chelsea - Aah! Bisto - had more brains and he is a Spuds Supporter!. Debate is not just about adopting a conciliatory attitude - it's about argument and difference of opinion,which can become heated at times,but who want's to just have a boring harmonious discussion with everyone holding the same view?. Only a moron like GunGun.


Mee
April 07, 2005
The use of other peoples handles is getting really tiresome - at least you can detect the false ones - just look at the spelling - or is it some kind of new text speak. Don’t expect Deano to comment on Al Hibbler.


Alex
April 07, 2005
Hiya i see that Tom dean is still here why cant he just go away hasnt he got anything else to do


Phil
April 07, 2005
If people like Tom continue to abuse this forum then unfortunately it is going to go downhill fast which is very sad considering recent events. Ignoring him so he gets bored of his own stupidity is probably the best bet but if one is as devoid of mental ability as he clearly is then I question the fact that he could actually get bored. Someone in authority on this forum needs to act because I for one get fed up scrolling through his rubish and all the false postings.


Boomtownchav
April 07, 2005
Yes I left my E-mail. Thought you could give us a shout without all this b*llocks


adam
April 07, 2005
is that you rik rak


Parkerknoll Gooner
April 07, 2005
I've been listening all afternoon to a track called "Do Nothin 'till You Hear From Me" sung by Al Hibbler, originally a Duke Ellington track I believe, I've been searching for the CD for about 5 years and finally got it from 101cd.com this morning. If you want to listen to a real voice then track this down, a real goosebumper of a voice.


Boomtownchav
richardw1@oce.co.uk
April 07, 2005
I am shocked at the level of total rubbish on this Forum. Hot news your having a laugh, Bin Laden, the Germans, who gives a s*it, although I did like the comment that you can say what you like "because you can". 2nd Place "lets keep it" what rubbish, were a shadow of last season and as far as Europe goes weve become a bit of a joke. The Yids in two weeks thats important, not some bloody has been Kraut.


Daz
April 07, 2005
i agree too it would be great fun and thierry henry could join in because he is soooooo fit.


Mee
April 07, 2005
i agree it would be a fantastic money erner living in arsenal where all the gays live


Daz
April 07, 2005
It's still funny, Tom, but not quite AS funny.


Bernard
April 07, 2005
That last post wasn't by me. Isn't using other people's handles or names worth a warning, Niall? Presumably it's Tom.


Bernard
April 07, 2005
Ithink i Daz, Mee , steve martin Exiled in newcastle, cannon balls and the commontator should start up a gay club seings we are all gay . Do you agree?


Bernard
April 07, 2005
Does anyone know what 'bitty' is? Daz, what was Martin Hayes a genius at, because it certainly wasn't playing football?


Daz
April 07, 2005
Don't come the cowboy with me, Sonny Jim.


Daz
April 07, 2005
Tom's a thirty five year old computer studies student from Guildford. Still listening to the beautiful and brilliant Kirsty McColl - see I'd far prefer to talk about that or Open Water or the genius of Martin Hayes than high-falutin' and possibly homosexual German words but if I get sidetracked then blame the sidetracker. Really nice song playing about her friend who goes to Australia. And he says it's brilliant there/there's something in the air/and sunshine everywhere/he's on the beach/and though he's changed somehow/it's in his postcards now/he's in Australia/but he's out of reach. Sweet and melancholy but in a good way like all the best songs.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
I've been trying to work out if Tom is either illiterate or dyslexic.


Mee
April 06, 2005
Bernard - i stand corrected, wasn’t aware of that.


Spaz
April 06, 2005
Tom's a wind-up. I was so waiting for the comment from "Commentator"". First time, post, Commentator? I suspect not. Don't love Jeremy Beadle either, Bernard, although I have much more time for Fidel Castro.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
You see Daz - that is inventive stuff. And they say education is going downhill these days. Tom couldn't come from that world. He just isn't sharp enough.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
Daz, don't you think it would be nice if we could all just love each other because we're all gooners, even Osama Bin Laden?


Daz
April 06, 2005
EEG: How about "your mum's E*G is so diseased the crabs are making rafts out of the scabs" which I heard the other day on the bus from one of the yout' dem. Don't go, decaf, I understand the sudden nausea but, you know what, E*G the boring po-faced E*Gs. If anybody else posts about "why can't we just love each other because we're all gooners" I think I'll throw up. It's E*Gs. First, I don't love all gooners. Second, I often call the ones I love E*Gs. And third - as decaf quite correctly says - often the debate does start about football and sometimes it segues (whoah!) into something else. If a certain poster is going to start fights about them or wilfully misrepresent you he's gonna get corrected. Should I be mature about it and turn the other cheek? Yeah probably but then if I was mature and grounded I wouldn't be on a forum in the first place. So suck it up, stop bleating like a bunch of girls, and get on with posting about WHATEVER YOU WANT. Here's the good news: nobody is stopping you.


JamesLT
April 06, 2005
DAVID.D: I think the guy you mentioned from "The Contender" killed himself. I haven't seen the show, but I've heard it's good. I did read something about it though, saying one of the contenders put a gun to his head after losing his fight and then arguing about custody of his child with his partner. Very tragic...


Bernard
April 06, 2005
I might be wrong but I seem to remember Platini once recommending to one of our French players, Vieira would be my guess, that he should join Juventus. So Mee, if my memory is correct, I don't agree that any self respecting Arsenal fan should automatically prefer him to get the job rather than Beckenbauer. Myself, I don't really care which one gets it.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Exiled,ok the GG comparasion was a little unfair though tiny acorns grow into tall Oak Trees - etc. But my point was that there is no evidence that Beckenbauer will be any worse than Platini from 'our' point of view if elected, probably no better either - despite the supposed French Connection. The failures of ourselves and United, etc, in Europe are not down to some conspiracy to thwart our ambition - but rather the unpalatable truth that we have not been good enough. Let's see if the Blue Scum can do any better.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
"Shcool"! See I can even do the spelling. Think Mr Deane is a wind up though since even the 7 year-olds my wife taught were a bit more cutting.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Actually - very sorry everyone. Extremely childish I know, but before she retired on the grounds of laziness, Mrs EEG was a teacher in a primary shcool in Hackney and I was trying to put into practice some of the youth communication skills she taught me.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
I know Tom - I think I caught it from your mum. Didn't realise these things could be sexually transmitted you see. And especially doing it that way.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Cannon - if your comments were based on a lack of national bias from Blatter then I'm not going to argue that one, but comparing the levels of corruption at FIFA with the likes of GG is just daft in my view. He has systematically raped football for his own personal gain and has absolutely no interest in the 'sport'. Him beating Johanssen was probably the worst thing to happen to football since the odious Havelange took power. If anyone has any doubts about how bad these people have been for football then Daid Yallop's book 'How They Stole The Game' is as good a place to start as any. It really is one hell of a shocking story.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Exiled, what you suggest about Blatter may well be true - but there is no evidence that he hasused his position to help Germany that i have ever heard suggested. Which is what Mick,GunGun suggest will happen if the Kaiser gets crowned. And let's be honest here if we want to look for corruption in football or sport in general we do not have to look much further than England - and the people like Ferguson and scum or Kenyon at Chelsea and we even had our own one at Highbury with GG getting caught with his hands in the till. I am only using Blatter to argue that there is no evidence that Beckenbauer will indulge in a fevered frenzy of teutonic one-sideness in favour of the Vaterland should he become King of Uefa; i have no argument with Blatter being a greedy self perpetrating money grabber b*****d, that is par for the course at the top in sport everywhere - including unfotunately the UK.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
I suppose it depends on what you intended to do at your "meeting" Mee. He might have thought it the traditional let-down in the circumstances.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Or even "sow". And what has this to do with pigs?


Mee
April 06, 2005
Exiled: Surely any self respecting Arsenal fan would vote for Platini? On a more personal level, I once had an appointment to meet Der Kaiser (a german friend of mine was his doctor at that time) but he cancelled our meeting saying he had a headache! I thought only women cancelled things because of headaches.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Come off it "Commentator". Enough of the pious "reap what you so" nonsense. Clearly you are a commentator of the Alan Green variety?


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Cannon - hold on - 'Blatter has done an excellent job'. Let's make no bones about this... Blatter has done an incredibly bad job for football and an incredibly good job for his personal wealth. He has continued the mass corruption that Havelange started (Blatter was his protege, and if memory serves his son-in-law). He has done nothing what so ever for the good of football and is solely responsible for many (all) of the stupid competitions foisted upon us. He uses FIFA as his own personal 'junket' supplier and continuously shaves off vast amounts of tickets for major events for his cronies and such like. I've no real opinions either way about Beckenbauer/Platini to be honest - which ever one gets in will have a natural bias towards there home country (as did Stanley Rous when he was head of FIFA).


Alan Hedges
April 06, 2005
According to Sky Sports, http://skysports.planetfootball.com/Article.asp?id=268337 Arsenal seem to be very interested in the Italian striker Andrea Caracciolo. what do you all think of this as a possible buy??


Commentator
April 06, 2005
Proof that you reap what you sow.The new poster known as Tom Dean seems to be conducting the exact same type of discourse as Chocolate & Daz,etc. except he does not seek to disguise the reasons for his attacks with references to fancy german words or obscure philosophical references.He calls you a "spaz" or a "no mates retard" simply because he suspects you might disagree with him.In reality I fear he is a joke wind up.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Mick,i have no knowledge that Beckenbauer 'robbed' SA of the world cup,i was not aware that SA had ever won it. Though i understand that it was stolen in London once, some people unkindly suggest twice!. Your obsession with the Germans rigging the football competitions for their own ends seems rather far fetched. I have already pointed out that Blatters been in charge of FIFA for years and done an excellent job. Beckenbauer is a reasonable man with a wealth of experience, and i would sooner him than someone like the drunken jock Ferguson running Uefa, then i would be worried. Kenyon phew! - time to watch Cricket, thats always been uncorrupted, oh!- hang on a moment - there was that scandal about match fixing though - where was it now ? - oh yes - South Africa!!!.


david.d
April 06, 2005
american - yes thats the programme(the contender). one of the best exports you have provided to us. in the last episode there was a guy called najib turner who was a bit of a loner but seemed very sure of himself but he lost the fight to sergio i think it was. it brought a lump to my throat as he was clearly distraught that he had lost and he had let down his wife and his little daughter and broke down as his daughter cuddled him. at the end of the credits it said in loving memory of najib so its obvious he has died this year. do you know what happened to him american? one of the best bits so has been when ishe gave a beating to ahmed kaddour who must be one of the most conceited arrogant guys who has ever lived. i think he would have eaten himself if he could! i think they they are still in the first round of fights so there is still a long way to go. if the tragedy you are referring to isnt the death of najib then leave me in suspense! what did you think of the programme anyway?


steve martin
April 06, 2005
Looking at the tables this season, I find it hard to believe the goalscoring of some teams, Only one has reached 70, one 60 and then it's united in the 40's... Take the Championship as well, the highest scorers are Ipswich 76 goals, the only team to score more than Arsenal, yet they have played 10 games more... Just like Chelsea, all that matters is defence, yet is it not ironic that we used to be called boring, but now the 4-5-1 is the norm, no one else seems to be tarred with the tag...


adam
April 06, 2005
arsenal are the best wats all this tom dean stuff about slasggin off arsenal


Exiled in newcastle
April 06, 2005
i am actually a newcastle fan spying on u stupid arsenal fans


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
No Tom you 'iz' not too late for me - just too stupid. Go play with the traffic, there's a good boy.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
So if Beckenbauer gets the job all referees in EUFA competitions will suddenly become corrupt to ensure German clubs reach the semi-finals of the European competitions. Yeah right. Mind you, if it is true it's a shame he hasn't been appointed already, considering who Chelsea are playing tonight.


Maurice
April 06, 2005
Regaining second place is great ! Let's stay there till the end of the season.


Mick L
April 06, 2005
Cannon Balls I would not be too sure that Beckenbauer is as clean as you make him. The moment he is in there WILL be a German conspiracy. You can bet your bottom cannon ball on that! Don`t be naive. The Kaiser will want successs for his country and nothing else. The Vaterland is what counts for a true German. He won`t care twopence about Europe. All Uefas refs will be desperate to oblige. Suddenly the Bundesliga clubs will all be in the semis of Europes competitions...not like this and last season when 5 clubs went out in one round. Beckenbauer proved his "integrity" when he robbed South Africa of the world cup. But you probably would not know that anyway. Platini any day. A much cleaner character than DEr Kaiser.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Would that be 'Chapel' my young illiterate friend?


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Tom - with the level of eloquence and intelligence you display I hope you enjoy your career as a DSS monkey.


Mee
April 06, 2005
Deano - just out of interest what are your views on ‘Existentialism in Pinters theatre?’


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
OK, old bill yesterday - DSS today. Not having had to much contact with them today was a shocker. I've a firend who's 'partially sighted'. Basically he can make out blurred shapes. Anyway, he has always worked but he's been through stuff recently that makes my life seem like a picnic and he's signed off sick. He had to drop off his sick note and asked me to go with him, which I did. We get there and there's two burly security guards just inside the door. Explained to them and asked for a pen to sign his form before handing it in. They refused! Someone was kind enough to lend us a pen and we handed in the form and the monkey started filling in the receipt. I noticed that he'd spelt my friends name completely wrong (it's not John Smith but it's just as hard) which I pointed out. 'So what?'. 'Well it's a receipt so surely he needs his name spelt right'. He then goes into a tirade about scroungers wanting everything for nothing and got even more angry when I pointed out that either my friends or my own tax bills for the year would pay his monkey wages for the year. He then refuses to accept the sick note! So I barged past monkey and sat at the first available desk where we were seen by someone else who was (slightly) more polite. The ignorance amazed me, but as I looked at the receipt on the way out one thing struck me. The official form they use is riddled with spelling mistakes - the best one being they spelt staff with one F (in a job centre). Now I know my spelling is appauling, but if they can't even spell staff...


Steve moron Martin
April 06, 2005
Phil the Gooner was a pain in the bum, but this Tom Dean fellow, is the business, please keep him on here, he is just so funny


Mee
April 06, 2005
Dear Deano - I expect you’ve got what us adults call ‘low self-esteem’ I expect your teachers have told you that already. I used to be a schoolteacher and if you ever need any help with your homework, things like spelling, I would be only too pleased to help.


Mee
April 06, 2005
Deano - may I call you that, I bet all you fav mates do! Now you musn’t swear, that’s being a very naughty boy and that nice Mr Mourinho would be upset if he knew that, wouldn’t he.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
Dave, the fact is I couldn't give a damn whether Beckenbauer gets the job or not.


Mee
April 06, 2005
Alex: I imagine it is just that - a rumour. Tom Dean: Good morning to you. I bet you didn’t tell your mum about missing school today - come to think of it, its half term. Make sure you get her permission to use the computer and don’t forget to turn all the lights off if you’re not using them.


Azinoz
April 06, 2005
Cannon, perfect I live very close to Botany bay anyway so I do know plenty of venues (all serving alcohol of course).


phil
April 06, 2005
anyone else noticed postings dissappearing?


Phil
April 06, 2005
Bobby yes but not Wayne...


Cannonballs
April 06, 2005
t**t


alex
April 06, 2005
phil do you know wayne ewing?


Alex
April 06, 2005
Have any of you heard the rumour of Steven Gerrard coming to Arsenal i think he will be a great buy what do you think


Phil
April 06, 2005
There is a player at the moment in Portugal playing at Benfica who has just broken into the Portuguese national team called Manuel Fernandes, he is a strong, fast skillful player who can tackle and pass the ball and scores a decent amount of goals, he covers every blade of the field and would be a fantastic signing, he is only 19 and plays like he has been around for years. For sure he won't be sticking aound in Portugal for much longer.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Azinoz,thank's i will take you up on your offer!. I expect to be in Sydney around about the 16th of December with my wife and will be staying in the Botany Bay area for a month. Nothing finalized yet - but i have told family and friends that we are coming over for Christmas - so i can't get out of it now!. My son and his girl friend are arriving in July they are touring around Asia at the moment and wanted us to come when they are there - but i prefer December when the weather is better - and also the chance to have a Christmas with relatives that i do not see that often.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
GunGun,how about conspiracy theories regarding Germans being bad for football then - or is it just the ones about Chelsea that are nonsense???. Speaking of Germans, Wenger must be furious with Lehmann after his latest 'mad-cap Jens' incident of throwing a bottle of water petulantly at the referee after the BM game at Huighbury. This two match ban will surely see the curtain come down on his time at Arsenal?. It's rather strange that the last top-class GK -Seaman - was signed by Graham back in 1990 and we kept him too long in the end when there were other good ones available.There seems to be a lack of really top class ones around at the moment. Buffon's got a big reputation but he did not look that special last night against the car-thieves - who may come to rue the clanger that their own GK made when they go to Turin to defend their narrow lead. Liverpoool made the usual EPL teams mistakes of throwing everything at Juventus in the first half and payed the price by tiring. The old Liverpool sides were able to hold on to the ball and slow the game down - our EPL teams will never do well in Europe untill they learn to do this. Let's see now if Chelsea can demonstrate the art of it tonight.


Azinoz
eddie.assirati@ce .com.au
April 06, 2005
Cannon, if Sydney is on your itinery I would consider it a pleasure to buy you lunch while your here. My email address is enclosed.


Västerås Gooner
April 06, 2005
...Who isn´t from a big football country but a small like Sweden, Finland or Belgium...


JamesLT
Zeitgeist/Squirrel Monkeys
April 06, 2005
EEG: I'm surprised no one picked up on your earlier point. This is only confidential, but I've also heard the rumour that "the look a Squirrel Monkey gives when you have entered his habitat" will definitely be added to the next edition of the Oxford English Dictionary as an alternative definition for Zeitgeist. Apparently, it isn't in general usage yet, but the dictionary will still include it to try and reflect the changing use of words. DAZ/CHOCOLATE/DAZ LITE©: Any comments?


Västerås Gooner
April 06, 2005
Dave, the reason Lennart Johansson isn´t to happy with either the english FA or Platini is because he feels he was betrayed a couple of years ago when Sepp Blatter became the FIFA president instead of him. It was "understood" that most european countries should wote for Johansson (just as all the southamericans voted for Blatter) but Blatter promised the english FA something (I can´t remember what is what all about now) but I think that is the main reason that Johansson supports the Kaiser. For all I know it could be another person as well, someone unknown who isn´t from a "big" football country like Sweden...


JamesLT
Beckenbauer or Platini
April 06, 2005
DAVE: Personally I'd prefer Der Kaiser to Platini as the next President of UEFA. Both are quite politically shrewd and probably a little slippery at times. Johannsson (an ardent gooner) is said to be endorsing Beckenbauer, and I think with good reason. Whatever you might say to criticize him, for example that the richest clubs like Bayern might get richer, Beckenbauer is also passionate about the traditions of football - including those in England. Beckenbauer would be a realist, letting the big clubs continue to increase their dominance (good for Arsenal), while protecting the core values of football. Platini was a magical player, but like Sepp Blatter he has endless daft ideas. Remember Platini's previous proposals to (a) increase the size of the goals, (b) make teams play with 10 players instead of 11 to create more space on the field, or (c) outlaw tackling to make football a non-contact sport with players only allowed to close down on the oppostion. As UEFA boss he'd be able to introduce these and other wacky ideas on a test basis in lower leagues, and what's the betting that one or two of the President's pet ideas might then eventually be adopted either within Europe or even globally if his mentor Blatter added FIFA's endorsement. Beckenbauer is the best option for me.


Decaf
April 06, 2005
But I agree that it is nonsense, and I am cringeing. You won't see another post from me until the new season. This is a detox, and not a sulk.


Decaf
April 06, 2005
Alex: this "nonsense" did start with football debates. The problem is that a certain party, when shown to hold a completely untenable position, has a tendency to wriggle and google and attempt all kinds of sophistry in an attempt to get off the ropes. In layman's terms, this is called "running away". Are we supposed not to pursue him?


Juliano
April 06, 2005
http://www.footytorrents.cjb.net/. You'll need a bittorrent client, like bittorrent or bittornado to download files. These sites always pop up and are closed down after a couple of months only for a new one to pop up again. A couple of months ago a site was called "Maxxed Football Torrents" and I could download all Arsenal games in Divx the day after they had been played. That was really great. The URL I did paste at the top of my post seems to be in China so maybe it will take time before they can close it.


Alan Hedges
April 06, 2005
Does anyone know where I can watch / download henry's hatrick from the weekend v norwich? I missed the prem league highlights show here in Australia and was wondering if I can view it anywhere??


steve c/o Cpldiz
April 06, 2005
I must agree with Alex.This squabbling over the last three monthes has become tiresome,boring and not needed.A couple of the posters miht loo back in a couple of monthes time ans cringe with embaressment.Essien is total class,but I´m afraid he is elsewhere bound.I believe Wenger has already pre-signed his next two signings who are his BIG name ones.I´d hazzard a guess that one is Totti ad the other a keeper.Beckham or Owen would do wonders for the franchise and AG,however both are not so fleet of foot anymore andif it were on footballin rouns they´d be better off in Toonlan or Boro.


Alex
April 06, 2005
American- I'm fine. You sound in good spirits as usual. Was watching College Basketball on TV the other night. It's a big deal I take it! I think I could probably take to it if I watched it regularly, and got used to the small playing area, and amount of 'baskets'. Are you a fan? Not sure about Quincy on the right. He models himself on Henry, and is effective when cutting in on his right foot. I do agree that we need another option on the right though. How can anyone say that Ljungberg should be sold! He's just had his best season! Loyal, hard working, and scores important goals. Irreplacable.


Alex
April 06, 2005
Mee- Don't you think signing Essien would be a little disheartening for Fabregas and Flamini? An older player would still give them hope for the future. Why is everyone defending Almunia? I assume he had a good first half. Liverpool! What is it they have that we don't? Can it really just be belief? Flumoxed! Can people (you know who you are) stop writing such unrelated b------s. It makes scrolling through the postings such a chore. Your arguments are not witty, clever, or interesting. Please take your scwabbles elsewhere.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
CB, I forgot about his telling the scousers to shush. If he goes, I wonder who will come in? You know Roman will throw money at Wenger. That's for sure. I can't see him wanting Sven. I hope he does get him, no offense but I'm not a big fan of your national team manager. In that alleged meeting with Roman, I have to think Roman is trying hard to placate him. Kissing his you know what. As much as I would hate to see Chelsea win it, I'd take it a little bit better if Ranieri was still there. He was always a gentleman and I couldn't begrudge him getting a title. My guess is possibly one of the Italian managers. O'Neil possibly but he's staying put till Fergie leaves. One other thing to consider, will this affect them for the remaining games? Lets say they have a disappointing game v. BM, the Cole matter gets finalized and its a harsh penalty, he's still pouting and not attending to getting points. They may win it, but it may be close. No matter what happens, we have to go to the Bridge and play like its a cup final. We need to keep our hoodoo over them in the league and sow the doubts that they are ever going to be good enough to beat us consistently and the QF CL last year was a one off.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Decaf, fluke doesn't do Porto's run justice. Name a club that has gone to the final in the CL without ever facing either Juve, Milan, Real Madrid or Bayern Munich in any of the knock out stages? I would have added Man Yoo but they go them when they were imploding, having gone from 1st that January to 3rd and losign to the likes of Wolves. I am convinced Mourinho has signed a deal with the devil.


GunGun
April 06, 2005
American Gooner....Platini is the other candidate but it looks like Uefa are partial to the Kaiser and he will get it unless Platini (who being French would be probably more Arsenal-friendly)does some serious lobbying and greases a few palms good and proper. But the Kaiser can grease more, I am sure.Cannon Balls, watch out, it all might be a Chelsea conspiracy


Mee
April 06, 2005
Looks like most things at Chelsea have a spin on them these days, including we hear, the players blood.


Mee
April 06, 2005
Just watched the highlights of the Lyon game. Essien looks better each time I see him. I hope the rumours and speculation surrounding Beckham, SWP, Owen prove false because Essien is the one player who could make the difference for us. Expect a massive bid from Chelsea or RM.


GaryB
April 06, 2005
I'm trying to understand some of the forum rules - can someone help? When someone says "I'm going to ignore (insert name here)", or someone else says "end of." (as in end of discussion) - then that's *EEG right? Damn this thing is complicated.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Unless I'm mistaken, the Cole-gate matter hasn't been resolved yet, right? Perhaps that may tip Mourinho over the proverbial edge? The FA may take their cue from UEFA and feel they have to make an example of them. Anyone know when the final decision is to be handed down?


Decaf
April 06, 2005
Cannon, start with his big "I am" departure and failure to congratulate his team when Porto fluked and cheated their way to the CL last year. Right there he said "I'm bigger than all this" and he's demonstrated that attitude ever since. I'm sure the Chelsea thing is going to end in tears, but I fear not soon enough.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
I thought about some of the things that he does and if they could be a 'psychological' ploy. but he does come over has being rather erratic, the incident with the Liverpool supporters in the LC Final which he later tried to pretend was directed at the media! - and other incidents suggests that he is not the rational cool person that he tries to portray himself to be. It's common knowledge among the media in London,with who despite earlier popularity he is becoming unpopular now, that he is being 'tapped up' by Continental Clubs. Everything at the Chavs is murky so anything can happen there in that cess-pit of nefariousness.


Decaf
April 06, 2005
"The only good thing about your idiotic post is that the bits you cut and paste were understandable, which is a huge improvement on your normal fare". Lovely! Pure brass! I'll give you that. And then to ask why I quoted the passage! The question is not why I quoted that passage. The question is why you did NOT "quote" it. The police are looking for a certain CG to assist them with inquiries about a couple sentences, which, since we don't want to be too jarring, seem to have fallen off the back of a truck. **** On to footy: what did you make, Choc, of the perfomance of the "'fortuitously stumble across' the odd car" lot from Mersey. Do you think they could "fortuitously stumble across" it from the Chavs?


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Dave, who will probably get the post? Beckenbauer or Platini? Who's the leading candidate?


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Very jealous of you, lucky b-----d!! I love to traveling to different countries. Interesting about Mourinho not attending the away match possibly. I wonder how the players are taking it? I'd think he'd like to show a sign of support to his players by being in the stands. Knowing his being there helps, if even a little bit. Strange. This is a stretch, but could his tirade be part of some big design of his? He was a psychology major and does and says things for a desired effect. **** Exiled, I'll be doing the scripting. ;-)


Dave
April 06, 2005
Daniel Cohn Bedit has seen the light and wants to form an alliance to stop Beckenbauer becoming UEFA chief. Johannsen though has said he will support Beckenbauers application. No surprise as Johannsen strangely was awarded the German Cross of merit out of the blue by the German interior minister. The story is bent and crooked before it has started and reminds me and apparently other forumites about how Beckenbauer pinche dthe World Cup from undewr Mandelas nose. Bernard, come out in defence of your bretheren.....


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
American, from what i can gather Mourinho is also refusing to go to the away leg in Germany too. And if he is disillusioned then it could have a knock on effect on the the Chavs - his psychological motivation playing a large part in their success. The 'Tag- Team' wrestling sounds fun, i may be in New York for a few days before Christmas. Probably October - but i guess that's a fair way from the main event,i will have to make do with a visit to Nevada Smiths for a few beers and watch some 'soccer'instead!. It depends on whether or not i can find the time, i am going to the Black Sea resort of Varna, Bulgaria in August and have trips to Istanbul, and Cairo on the itinerary too. Then in December it's off to OZ for a month over Christmas and the New Year. But i have had an invite to go to New York and keep promising to go, it's a few years since last i was there, so i have to fit that in somehow if i can among my many other various activities - like posting on here!.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
American - if it's going to be 'anything goes' WWE who's going to write the script and set up the stunts? It's not real wrestling like Big Daddy and Giant Haystacks...and Jimmy Saville!!!


N5er
April 06, 2005
Bernard (and Nico) thanks for the info re Diamond club, needless to say I know what I'll ask for next Xmas! ;_)


Decaf
April 06, 2005
American, I thought that Liverpool were nothing short of *G* in the second half. Took the foot completely off Juve's neck (note the wrestling theme) and paid the consequence. Silly.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Decaf, I concur about their first half performance. They had to dredge up le Tallec from St. Ettiene for goodness sakes. Gerrard had to play striker on Saturday. I would love for them to go through only if I knew for sure Chelsea wouldn't. I'd rather have Chelsea face Juve instead of the scousers if they make it to the next round. If Juve scores in the first half in Turin its over. Chasing a game at Juve is not what you want to do (although the Mancs did it in '99...and I was praying otherwise at the time). **** CB, it may be a reason why Deco didn't follow him to Chelsea. He knew the kind of nutter he was and was good enough to write his own ticket to top clubs. Carvallo and some of his other Porto players didn't have a name so they followed the money. As for the wrestling match, its WWE, so its anything goes. There are a couple of loud mouthed, puny-looking, cockney Man Yoo guys at the pub that couldn't beat eggs. They'd make good 'Cannon fodder'. **** Where is that Chelsea fan that comes on here once in a while, Charlie is it? I'm curious as to what the Blues fans generally think about it. I peaked at a forum of their last week and they were doing the 'we're being treated harshly because everyone is jealous of us' thing. Can't say I wouldn't feel the same if it were us, but we took our handbags at OT punishment like men. 4 first team players banned and fined and we responded by winning.


Decaf
April 06, 2005
American, I thought that Liverpool were nothing short of brilliant in the first half, and Garcia splendid. (I haven't watched the second yet.) It just shows what you can do when you have the players and you decide to take the game by the scruff of the neck. That what we are good at. Its utter nonsense that it doesn't work in Europe. Leave the cagey stuff the Italians, I say.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
The Car-Thieves had a chance at 2-0 but that away goal is makes it tough. We went there once long ago and won 1-0 in Turin - somehow though i can't see the scousers keeping a clean-sheet,Juve hit the post in the first half too and i can see them getting a couple of goals at home. Even 2-0 it would have still been tough,but you never know in football but i would not put any money on Liverpool to get through. Shame really because the EPL will not have any teams in the next round!.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Liverpool must be doing it with smoke and mirrors. They looked great in the first half. 2-0 half time lead. Still think they will not go through, especially having given up the away goal. A 1-0 win in Turin is totally within the realm of possibilities. **** I wonder if Cole-gate had not happened if Ash would have been captain on Saturday? He's the longest serving Arsenal player wasn't he?


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
American,put me down for the Tag-Team - only though if i am allowed to use a Base-Ball Bat !.


George Bernard Shaw
April 06, 2005
"What I say today everybody will say tomorrow, though they will not remember who put it into their heads. Indeed they will be right for I never remember who puts things into my head : it is the Zeitgeist." I hope everyone enjoyed scrolling today.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Mourinho is getting too carried away with himself and the amount of incidents that he has been involved in show that he cannot handle pressure.The manic celebrations after each win for example are an indication of that - he is a control freak and obviously resents Kenyons participation in the running of affairs. He could head for the exit at the end of the season and go to a bigger club that he feels is more in keeping with his 'genius' if he feels that Chelsea are not really worthy of him. It all addds more pressure on tomorrow nights match and it will be interesting to see how the Chavs handle it.If they come unstuck Mourinho can blame his absence - if they do ok it will be down to his careful planning and coaching!.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
CB, frankly I didn't think Mourinho will go, but if he does and it seems a bit more likely with each passing day, he is such a cry baby!! He will definitely not work well with the pressure cooker that Real Madrid is. Okay, be upset you didn't get the proper support but if he ups and quits, I'll have more than a good laugh about it all. **** DaveM, first of all thanks for your posts on the reserves as well. I agree with part of your recent post that Ljundberg and Gilberto are better suited for certain type of opponents. I disagree however on the opponent. Against the likes of Bolton, Man Yoo and other clubs who show more skill in kicking a shin than a football, we need Freddie. He's a battler. He has bottle and will not be intimidated as a Pires or a Reyes might be. That's where players like Parlour were very handy in as well. Against the flair sides, especially in Europe and the lesser sides in the league or against any side that wants to play football, flair and skill on the ball are more relevant. I'd take Quincy over Freddie in those types of games. Or Cesc instead of Gilberto. **** I really like playing Cole and Clichy on the left at times. I'm not saying it should be our first choice selection but if we're trying to protect a lead and make substitutions, having them both on the left is something to consider. Each time they've played there as a LB/LW team they have played in sync together and at times switched positions and one will go forward while the other stays. It also adds a lot of pace to the left side and keeps the other teams honest who have to worry about a counter. They know each others game well which I have to conclude comes from training together in the same position. **** Parkerknoll Gooner, he's also pledged a billion dollars to advance black and minority students in getting high tech college degrees. He's a bit of a philanthropist here and unlike most of our rich, I don't think its for the tax benefits or to garner good PR so they don't get tagged with an oligarch label. Not excusing some of the corporate practices of his company however, just acknowledging some of the good. He can buy and sell Roman a few times over. **** Niall and Daz, I'd like to fly you two over here to be the undercard for my Dyer/Bowyer main event. I'm turning promoter. The other under card is a Man Yoo supporter and an Arsenal supporter in a WWE tag team wrestling match. I'm participating in that one. I'm thinking of asking Cannon Balls to partner me. All 4 will be wearing their clubs shirt. I'm hoping Sky will televise live to you guys. I'll need one of you to do the FanZone portion for Arsenal.


Gaz ( B/Wood )
April 06, 2005
Just a little piece (from the emirates website) on our new Stadium. Most of it we've all seen but it does include one image (walking up the steps) that I've never seen. http://www.emirates.com/miniSites/Offers/Arsenal/TheEmiratesStadium/TheEmiratesStadium.asp Come on Arsenal.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Aliadiere was quoted recently to be unhappy (since retracted but..) and he can't complain. He's been given chances and had the bad luck of suffering injuries. Not Wenger's fault. He can't blame the club for hindering his progress. I certainly do hope he progresses and pushes van Persie, Lupoli, Quincy and others for a starting position. It would be great if we found our striker from within without having to buy, but as it stands we may need some quality from elsewhere till they develop to the standards that we require. **** david.d, regarding The Contender tv show, is that the same one we have here that we exported to you guys? With Sylvester Stallone of Rocky fame and former champ Sugar Ray Leonard? There is a boxer from Philly that has a tragic thing happen. I won't spoil it by saying too much, but its a bit touching when they get to it. **** Finishing 2nd will mean we get a tougher draw in the group stages, right? **** Not sure Myles Palmer agreeing with me that Pires was the main one at fault for the Norwich goal is a good thing or bad thing. Some things he writes is original, but the self back slapping and political rants and family business stuff gets a bit annoying.


AmericanGooner
April 06, 2005
Alex, Eskimo and Xav T (how are things with you by the way?)thanks for your comments on the game. Quincy is interesting. I have repeatedly said I think he should be used on the right so that he can get minutes since we are lacking someone to challenge Freddie on the right. Also, because I think he'll do the same job for us what Ronaldo does for Man Yoo when he's on his game. I want SWP but in the meantime, we can add someone who can dribble with pace and beat their man on the right. I think if he's put in some games he'll bring his quality of play up to meet the standards of the PL. Its time for him to get minutes in the first team. He'll make mistakes as he's learning but I think he'll be a revelation. If Reyes goes, which eliminates a striker/winger, I'd buy Yakubu and have Freddie, Pires and Quincy play left and right wings for us and Clichy substituted on if we are defending a lead late in the game. **** I certainly think Eboue is our full back. Hoyte is no slouch either. I like Lauren. He bleeds red for the shirt. I think we can win with Lauren in the first team but for my money, we have a better player in Eboue and a better player for the future than Lauren in Hoyte. I'd like him on the bench to play RB or center mid if we need a substitution. I've heard some say he can or should play wide right. What? He's not a wide right player. He may have played there before but that doesn't mean he's good at it. I pitched for 2 years as a kid in baseball but I'm no pitcher. **** As for the copy and pasting. I wish some would copy and paste what I actually said at times. ;-)


Decaf
April 06, 2005
Apols Babiolakis? One of Nico's cousins?


The Kant Copper
From Sections 50-54, Prolegomena (Kant)
April 06, 2005
Choco asked: "in which case may I suggest that you do likewise and stumble across a website which will confirm that Kant is linked to the dialectical method of antithesis: thesis: synthesis?" Decaf is out having a puff (and enjoying it greatly, Niall) and slaying wild beasts, and asked me to look this up. Sorry that it doesn't come from a google site, and for any errors (as I copied it out of a silly old thing call as book)! Kant says: "Thesis: The world has, as to time and space, a beginning (limit). Antithesis: The world is, as to time and space, infinite. I pledge myself as to the correctness of all these proof--and reason therefore perceives that it is divided against itself ... The only possible way in which reason could have revealed unintentionally its secret dialectic ... blah, blah, blah". Totally inconclusive, right?


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Whos Apols?


Decaf
April 06, 2005
DaveM: I agree with most of what you say, particular about Ljungberg. I'm not sure about Gilberto at all. I'd like to see Fred used as an impact player, playing for maybe the first half, running around like a maniac, and making a nuisance of himself in the box, and using his experience. I think Fred is useful against any opposition (not just Norwich), but I can't see the point of him plodding up and down the touchline for 90 minutes, creating very little, and I hope van Persie gets a lot more time there next season.


Decaf
April 06, 2005
And a splendid one it was too, Mee, although I must say that almost all of the interesting posts today have had little to do with football. Could it be the "football only" people are a little jealous? Oh, and Choc, I take back "dextrously scuttling". There is nothing dextrous about you at all. You are a sinister little E*G.


Niall
April 06, 2005
Apols, I have accidently lost the postings from April the 4th in case you are wondering where they went when updating the site. I fully accept due whipping in good grace!!


Decaf
April 06, 2005
Choc, you can ignore me if you like. In any case, you'll find I never START any non-football debate (now who is the one most responsible for that?), and why one earth should I respond to attacks either to myself, to logic, to honesty, or to good taste? One just wonders how much of what you contribute here is lifted wholesale from other sites. Fair enough I suppose to use terrorist tactics when you are completely outgunned, which would say was the case even when the pompous LT rolled in and has an unsavoury encounter with Dazs behind. You also seriously underestimate South African undergrads. If I said a "answer ONE question out of four," and then changed the rules (and inserted several other questions) after they had written the exam, and worse, refused to explain when I have given people zero, there would be a bit of a fuss.


Mee
April 06, 2005
The last two postings ascribed to mee - weren’t from me - my last posting was the Roy Bentley one.


DaveM
April 06, 2005
The key to players like Gilberto and Ljungberg is they are good for certain types of games and bad for others. If we only played sides likes Norwich on sunny days then there'd be no problem and we'd win the league by miles. Unfortunately, the league is decided in games against your close rivals and when playing physical, committed teams who close down and foul repeatedly, on days where the weather ain't great. Gilberto and Ljungberg aren't best suited to that, as they have shown time and time again. This would be fine if Wenger would drop them after bad performances or would take into account the opposition when picking the side, but he won't. Therefore we won't win the league and we won't be able to beat awkward sides like BM either whilst those two are in the squad.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Well the wheels are starting to come off already at the Bridge .Murinho is refusing t be a he game tomorrow nigh and says he is not getting the backng of the club. Adios amigo!!!Real Madrid here he comes..


Steve Martin
April 06, 2005
Not sure how many of you are members of Arsenal, well today I got my membership magazine… Just a few facts for you, there are 21.161 goal level members… 23.410 silver members… 44.098 red level members and 14.404 junior gunners… The oldest member is Mr G Phillips (93) the closest member is Thomas Collins 0.1 Km’s from the ground, the furthest Jeff Dobson, Kalliness, Shetland Islands… Furthest overall member Michael Ham, Parnel, Auckland, most popular district for members N1 1866 members… the average season ticket holder is 44 years old and live 32 Kms from the ground and 89% are male, red level members live an average 77,4 kms from the ground…


mee
April 06, 2005
sorry about tom dean


mee
April 06, 2005
do you really think iam going to set roy bently on you. your a moron because you beleved me


DaveM
April 06, 2005
The reserves were excellent last night. I though Djourou and Van Persie had particularly good games. Djourou is going to be a sensation. I think he's a better prospect than Senderos (the Swiss aren't half going to have a good central defence). He's ready for first team action, and could certainly be considered when we're counting our centre-backs for next season. For an 18 year old he's certainly big, he's quick, good in the air, tackles well, is a leader (he was really helping Eboue) and he's as good a footballer as you're likely to find at centre-back. I haven't been so excited since I first saw Cesc play. All in all I thought the defence was probably better than the one we played on Saturday. VP is creating as well as scoring, and I think he could yet make it for us. Aliadiere is a natural goalscorer, and I'd like him to stay. When Reyes leaves that would leave us with Henry, Bergkamp (but even if he stays he won't figure in more than about a quarter of games next season), VP, Aliadiere, and Quincy (who also had a good game wide left). Given how many goals we've scored this season, and the extraordinary number of young attacking players we have (Ryan Smith and Lupoli will both be better next season too) I'm not sure we need to buy a striker. However, I can imagine Wenger loaning Quincy out and bringing a striker in. Speaking of loanees, I thought Bentley did ok. He seems physically stronger, tracked back well and put some dangerous and inventive balls into the box. I wonder what Wenger made of him? Having seen that I'm still of the opinion we should concentrate on a Keeper and either SWP or Joaquin (even Chelsea can't buy them both). Out go Lehmann, Ljungberg, Edu and Reyes (bad attitude to the opportunity he's been given, and a poor decision maker on the pitch - I just hope we get our money back). I'd be happy for Lauren to go to, as one of Eboue, Hoyte and Toure is bound to be better. I'd like us to keep Cole, and to play him left-midfield for a substantial number of games.


Mee
April 06, 2005
Tom - If you dont go away - I’ll get Roy Bentley to tell your mum.


Daz
April 06, 2005
Fair enough, so in order to illustrate the tiny issue of "being part of" which has now been explained to you ten million times, you judged it opportune to google, cut-and-paste and "forget" to source a great big lump of Hegel.Net.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Tom,have you got two brothers called Dick and Harry???


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Rob K - understood. Not sure about you changing the rules but as you say lets hope it is a moot point. There does seem to be some difference between what you say and various suggestions/mission statements about expanding the membership etc. Anyway, thanks.


Myles Palmer
April 06, 2005
LAST WEEK I was saying to friends that if Ashley Cole was picked at left back against Norwich, he would stay at Arsenal.He started at left back, Arsenal beat Norwich 4-1 to go second on goal difference, and Arsene has said he wants Ashley to stay.A manager has to say that because there are eight games left to play.Ashley was booed at Highbury, but as Bob Dylan once said, "There's a little bit of boo in all of us."Thierry Henry scored a hat-trick and now has 181 goals for Arsenal.181 goals in such a short time is a mind-boggling total.FREDDIE scored with a header from ten inches.Last week's Sky stats by Rob Bateman showed that the second most efficient finisher in the Prem was Andy Johnson with a conversion ratio of 30.50 %.Pires was 5th with 28.60%Henry was 8th with 21.60 % and 102 shots.Who was the most clinical finisher in the Prem ?Who was the most clinical with 9 goals from 24 shots?Whose conversion ratio was 37.50% ?FREDDIE LJUNGBERG !!!!!Huckerby scored a great Thierry goal, a rocket shot from the left side after Pires pretended to tacback and playing like he's never been away. Arsene knows how to tune them up after rehab and bring them back at the right time.The manager admitted that the Brazilian has been badly missed for the last six months."The positive thing is when he didn't play, people realised how important he is and he became a more highly-rated player," said Arsene."It's not only because he protects the centre backs, it's also because he's good in the air and we have conceded many goals from crosses this season."It's a shame as sometimes people, who have real team attitude rather that a flashy one, only get that kind of recognition when they don't play. "People forget that Gilberto is a world champion, but he's a quiet guy and he doesn't want special attention.


Rob K
Rob_K_@hotmail.co.uk
April 06, 2005
EEG - I think you've misunderstood our role. When Steve passed away I accepted responsibility for keeping the site going. I have been very kindly helped by Rog & Niall. There are no 'dutys' or 'guardians'. We will apply the existing rules as we see fit but if necessary I will change the rules. I hope this is moot as I would rather leave the forum to its usual random-walk and not intervene at all.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Nah Chocolate - it was you who used "football" as a comparitor. And it was a stupid one. The word "Zeitgeist" is a million times closer to "football culture" or "pop culture" or whatever type of term used to describe a movement than it is to "football" which is a ****ing simple noun. You used a stupid example. I used a better one from the same base. And one that was at least in some way relevant to the discussion. Daz was describing Nikola as being part of the Zeitgeist. To that end your use of "football" is typically dishonest.


Fred
April 06, 2005
Leave Tom D alone he has every right to gloat! Chelsea consider Arsenal their "derby match" they have been in our shadow since the Prem began and flunked in the old first divison. Personally I'm not offended. After the brillant season they are having it will be comedy award worthy entertainment watching them trying to repeat it!


chocolate gooner
April 06, 2005
EEG… no offence but you’re floundering. In what way are the words ‘zeitgeist’ and ‘football culture’ comparable. You might as well say that if someone were to ask you to define the word ‘family’ and you started by say that it means “being part of… …” ‘being part of’ isn’t wrong in every case!! If someone asks you define “Team”, “Nation, etc, etc you could very well use ‘being part of’ to define these words. That doesn’t make it right for every word and it most certainly doesn’t make it right for ‘Zeitgeist’… whether you’re using it as defined by the concise thingy or whether you use it as Hegel used it. That is the point.. the only relevant point. Cheers and goodnight. Really.


Cannon Balls
April 06, 2005
Who are the Chavs playing in the FA semi ???


Mee
April 06, 2005
Tom - here’s my number - 1955


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
But Chocolate - if in my original post I told someone they were part of the "football culture" and when asked what I meant by "football culture" I said I meant "being part of the social conditions attaching to the sport of football" it would take a proper ****** to say "part of" had no place in any definition of "football culture" and therefore my definition was wrong.


Spaz
April 06, 2005
It is indeed, Tom. Where are the moderators 'cos you're straying dangerously off-topic and you'll be in the doghouse with me soon.


Daz
April 06, 2005
The good thing is that you can be a fraction wrong in giving an explanation without making that explanation substantially wrong. So, like I've said, quite happy to accept that "being part of" is not included in the term itself but that the explanation given was sufficient to explain what it means. To pretty much everybody but you. When it comes to plagiarism, however, that's another matter- you can't plagiarise a bit - you either do or you don't. You did. And much to your discredit you insist there's nothing wrong with it.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Xav T - My brother phoned and they do have lots - all at £45. I am in the £55 seats so hopefully that means the ones around me will be sold out. Why do I always let the bloke who is the most paranoid on Earth get the final/semi tickets? I always tell him to limit it at the cheapest but he is always paranoid they will sell out so does the open cheque thingy. So do many others no doubt which is how Arsenal manage to sell out all the more expensive ones. £55 for Blackburn in the semi!


Daz
April 06, 2005
Brilliant parody of a chelsea fan, Tom. I am a spazzed up morron for falling for it.


chocolate gooner
April 06, 2005
My initial pop as you put it was directed to Exiled and was entirely meant for him because he wanted to know why I had a problem with the dictionary definition… I told him. I thought you were the one talking about context? I told Exiled why I thought the explanation offered was a shallow one… what’s your problem? To Daz and Babu I made it clear that even on Concise thingymajig definition, the explanation offered was still wrong and it is WRONG. What’s your point? That it’s only a little bit wrong?… ho hum. Although the meaning of the word is utterly changed… it’s merely technical??? Squirrel monkey logic, I presume. Cheers. Goodnight


Xav T
April 06, 2005
By the way, guys, I went to Highbury this morning to collect my Boro ticket. I could see behind the window at the box office a huge pile of FA cup semi final tickets yet to be sold. I hope that I’m wrong but it may very well be that the few of us going to Cardiff will be surrounded by a lot of empty seats!


david.d
April 06, 2005
tom. give up now mate. your posts are embarrassing to say the least. as bernard pointed out how many championships have you won?


Daz
April 06, 2005
It's like white noise or a car alarm or the sound of a bass in three in the morning. Just give it up, you idiot, it's finished, stop trying to drag sophism back into it. You get your stuff from web-sites and you plagiarise it. End of.


Daz
April 06, 2005
That's a shame - Tom Dean's a funny prank and not a real person. Ure funny M8 -ne views on the zeitgeist, d'ya get me?


chocolate gooner
April 06, 2005
By the same token saying that Sophism isn’t philosophy given the dictionary definition of Philosophy and Sophism respectively is an even more reasonable proposition because that particular set of dictionary definitions brook no argument. Did you come up with particular argument at the time? Give it a rest. It isn’t reasonable to define a word wrongly when someone asks you directly for a definition. How is it reasonable to say that ‘food’ means ‘being part of sustenance or whatever’? or that ‘football’ means ‘being part of round leather ball that one kicks’? ‘being part of’ actively changes the meaning of the word. On the other hand if you use language like a squirrel monkey then.. may be this fairly obvious thing is a bit over your head. Cheers.


Daz
April 06, 2005
And hilariously, chocolate, you didn't offer that definition even when invited to. As I say, apart from too a wilful plagiarising idiot like yourself "being part of the time or spirit of the age" does not change the meaning significantly because everybody understood what I was talking about. Now I'm more than happy to concede that "being part of" referred back to what I was talking about and is not part of the substantial meaning of zeitgeist which is the spirit or attitude of the age - uberclear to anybody with half a brain. You denied anyway that something CAN actually belong to the zeitgeist when it is clear that a book or idea or piece of music or even fashion can and does belong to the spirit of the age. This is all a great big pile of steaming guff, wilful pedantry simply to conceal the fact that you cut-and-pasted your irrelevant material about "the geist" from a web-page, gave us a lecture like the patronising little turd that you are without acknowledging it and got caught, bang to rights, doing it. In my book that's a bit more of a howler.


Parkerknoll Gooner
April 06, 2005
Dear Tom, djiu mjdioou njgiuh njifoot nhfyyrun nhnsyuqbn! Dhjfujuirtjj kfllikhm ipgk kjsygh lpgio kjhsp mikdfo okf mok iisipog ildj!!! AHHFYYHGSVUV HFHFDTB! Is that clear enough for you, please excuse the shouting at the end.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
But telling Goonerguru that he was using "Zeitgeist" in a post TO NIKOLA to refer to her being part of the spirit of the time, as my friends the Squirrel Monkeys would have worked out without even having to divert their minds from the task of baring their teeth at four year olds, was entirely reasonable. You went off on one for no good reason and you are still doing it. Your initial pop had absolutely **** all to do with the "part of" and that being the thing you said linked it to fashion. You said it was all about this much deeper meaning (using your nicked quotes) and that to talk about Zeitgeist in the context of using text language was some kind of crime against the "Geist". That was the only real b******s spoken on the subject.


steve martin
April 06, 2005
Bernard, it's that stuff they give the players or used too anyway, Creatine, Chavs, have style (not), Chavs can't spell...


steve martin
April 06, 2005
So am I Tom Dean, so am I... Tell me, Tom, where did you get your Burberry cap and bling from...


Bernard
April 06, 2005
Bet you wouldn't have realised it had I not told you I had. By the way, what is 'createn'; it's a new one on me?


chocolate gooner
April 06, 2005
EEG… for the last time. Zeitgeist even by the concise thingy is defined as “the spirit of the age” or “the essence of an age” or even “attitude of an age”. Now it is not defined as being part of anything. “Being part of” entirely changes the meaning of the word … it makes it a ‘fashion’. You may well choose to consider this a minor change (God help your clients) but that isn’t the point… the one and only point is that the explanation offered to Goonerguru was WRONG and MISLEADING. And given that that explanation came from someone who professes to be very up with Western philosophical thought by virtue of his degree or whatever… I am right to expect a better appreciation of the word. That’s it. Not even a dusty Thesaurus tells us that ‘Zeitgeist’ means being “part of” anything. Context doesn’t come into it …but even if you drag in the issue of context, our Thesaurus doesn’t even say that the word ‘Zeitgeist’ means just ‘contemporary’ alone which makes its use in relation to Nikola’s post baffling, to say the least… and all this is just if we consider the ordinary rather sloppy usage of the word!!... not its deeper meaning. So talking about technical levels and context doesn’t get you very far. “Being part of the Spirit of an age”… and “Spirit of an age” do not mean the same thing. They can’t possibly mean the same thing… not to anyone with a brain… and I bet that if I’d said it your tune will be entirely different. But hey! you’re no lap dog. Now, if you have something really deep and interesting to add I'm willing to listen and learn otherwise.... let it lie. Cheers.


steve martin
April 06, 2005
Tom dean, more please, a very funny Chelsea fan, who keyboard keys are all over the place... Nuff said... Daz, nice to see your learning your place, one step below Tom Dean, JAJ...


adam and alex
April 06, 2005
we are sorry to hear about the news of steves death RIP Steve you are a true arsenal legend lets hope arsenal win the fa cup for you


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
And I am not sure that my mum and dad know I'm on the computer.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
To be fair, he may be a bit green but the lad can read people pretty well.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
What an opportune time to mispell writing.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
I'd rather sound like an old man than have my writinmg giving the impression that I'm illiterate! Look it up if you don't know what it means.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Niall - you need a snout mate. Of course you know I wont be emailing you or any of the other "moderators" with any issues and will continue to post any concerns on the forum. Thanks for the suggestion though.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
After reading Tom's so eloquent contributions, I trust GunGun has a better understanding of my own and Cannon Balls' feelings towards that small club from Fulham.


G W F Hegel
April 06, 2005
This is for AG; from my Lectures on the Philosophy of World History when speaking of America: "It is a land of desire for all those who are weary of the historical Arsenal of old Europe"


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Tom, thank you for your detailed and interesting posts. Now hopefully the sedatives will work better next time the nurse comes round. Care in the community... bad idea.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
The main point is that if you read the original posts by Daz, the posts by JamesLT, McQuilkie and Exiled and of course my own quite brilliant contributions what smacks you just above the eye like a wooden toy in the hands of an eleven month old is that no-one but you actually thinks there is anything major in this. Now if Daz had described "Zeitgeist" as "the look a Squirrel Monkey gives when you have entered his habitat" then you might have been entitled to jump up and holler. But his definition and use of the word was fine and it took you an hour of googling to find something that you thought just might help you out. Let me help you instead. I am trying to save you from yourself Chocolate.


East End Gooner
April 06, 2005
Chocolate - Its more that I know you listen to me and respect my views so I hoped I could persuade you to drop what is a bit of a non point. Truth is that though JamesLT is correct on a technical level, Exiled is also right that Daz's definition was on the whole right and unaffected by the additions used really to explain the context.


Bernard
April 06, 2005
tom, Arsenal are the worst what in the premiership? Team - don't think so somehow as there are eighteen teams currently beneath us. Fans - don't think so ether, as we sell out our ticket allocation for away games more regularly than Chelsea.


Lex E Cographer
April 06, 2005
Chocolate gooner February 18 2005 "If you want to ascertain what the correct usage of a word with a range of meanings is, in a conversation where there is a clear context, the place to look is a thesaurus not a dictionary."…….Roget's Thesaurus - index - 'zeitgeist'.. tendency 179n: direction, course, stream, main current, main stream, zeitgeist, spirit of the times, spirit of the age; conatus, nisus, affinity. Oops……


Daz
April 06, 2005
Do mummy and daddy know you're playing with the computer, tom?


Bernard
April 06, 2005
Tom, we also have eleven more championship titles in our history, and that's even after conceding you'll win it this year.


Sabir
April 06, 2005
We have History!!!!


Bernard
April 06, 2005
N5er, Nico just got in touch. It's 84 diamond memberships that are available, representing 168 seats (as one membership equates to two seats). So that's where I got the 168 (or at least the 1 something 8) from. Now as Daz is being so modest about his growing status as a playwright, I imagine he'll be taking one membership (so that Chocolate can sit in the other seat he'll get for it). That means there's at most only 83 memberships left.


Daz
April 06, 2005
Well I'm not quite in their league yet. Or for that matter Harlow's. Still sit in the Clock End with the swinish multitude but hopefully that'll change soon.


Niall
April 06, 2005
Er, Daz, bud, wink, thumps up, , as you know I am in good form and would rather not discuss it but hey there ain't much else on offer at the minute bar zeitgeist so er, stick out tounge. Actually, combining giving up smoking with a pretty nasty bug but have had to come into work (where naturally I got it) due to HR clamping down on us genuine sick people the gits...Anyway cheering on the scousers tonight?


Bernard
April 06, 2005
Or perhaps stinking rich playwrights, Daz?


Daz
April 06, 2005
OK, whoever's got Niall can they just let him go and take the moderator back to the mother ship and we'll say no more about it. LOL Smiley emoticons, Garfield cat holding placard reading joke etc etc. etc. Actually, Niall - if I could just stray off topic for a moment - giving up smoking is a really good thing. I've gone for five months now. Helped by a partner who shrieked like chocolate gooner's long lost sister every time I lit up. In the end, it just wasn't worth it. Stick to your guns ( in a metaphorical sense of course).


Bernard
April 06, 2005
N5er, I would love to see the list of people they're inviting to take diamond membership. Stinking rich businessmen (or to be politically correct, should I say businesspersons) who are known to support Arsenal, of course. But I'd imagine celebrities who are presumably raking it in (or have raked it in) would also be on the list like the Melvyn Braggs, Robert Winstons, Clive Andersons, Frank Warrens, Alan Davies' of this world.


Niall
April 06, 2005
EEG - as Rob doesn't appear to be around at the minute, we of course thank you for your opinion and your appreciation of the task ahead for us. As Rob has said and I can confirm, we will be attempting to run the website even handedly and with light moderation for the good of all its contributors in the future. As stated yesterday, if you have any queries in the future as to the moderation of the site you are welcome to email your suggestions to us - as it is very unlikely we will enter any debate on moderation on the main forum.


Daz
April 06, 2005
The Sex Pistols are number one again! Sorry, ruined it for you, Exiled. Anway, I wasn't specifically thinking about Nikola but was alluding to those contemporary things (particularly the txt language he/she used) which are often described as being part of the zeitgeist. This was a JOKE based on Nikola's insistence on the contemporary rather then the past. So my explanation included being part of and simply subsituted "prevailing spirit or attitude of the time" for zeitgeist. But yes "being part of" isn't actually contained in the words 'zeit' or 'geist' . So E*Ging what, I wasn't translating it. It would take a wilful simpleton (chocolate) or a stirring pedant (Mr LT) to say from that I didn't understand the term or start dancing about like a demented, plagiarising baboon shrieking WRONG, WRONG, WRONG and spouting a pile of cut-and-pasted garbage from Hegel.Net.


Sabir
April 06, 2005
The Liverpool match tonight will be interesting. I think the scousers are in for a hammering! Quincy needs to be nurtured and brought in slowly. He could replace Pires or Freddy for the last 20 minutes of games that are already in the bag for a start. Bodies/Cannon - thanks for the film suggestions. Not really a slasher fan but I have enjoyed some slasher movies. I thought The Village wasn't very good - a bit overhyped. I saw the Woman in Black at the theatre and thought it was really good. Psychologically scary films are the ones that do it for me. Anyway, I feel we have quite a tough run-in, it would be fantastic if we could hold onto second spot (and win the Cup).


Exiled In Newcastle
April 06, 2005
Just a thought. With three players sent off, and two of them having a stand up fight on the pitch, shouldn't Newcastle United be charged with failing to control their players?


N5er
April 06, 2005
cheers Bernard, even so thats a nice little earner!


Bernard
April 06, 2005
N5er, I think it's either 128 or 168, but it could be 158 (I'm fairly sure it's 1 something 8, but can't recall the middle number). I've asked Nico in case he can remember.


Exiled InNewcastle
FAO Punk Gooner
April 06, 2005
Mate, I know you read this board when you're in a port. You need to contact me urgently - and it's good not bad. Cheers (and sorry to everyone except Punk Gooner).


N5er
April 06, 2005
My googlesearch on AG packages available has found this little gem >>>the exclusive Diamond Club, which is by invitation only and costs £12,500 annually and a further £12,500 for a 35-year membership, offers unrivalled luxury >>> Anyone know anymore like how many memberships are available? Quite a money spinner.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
Got to say I thought the 'being part of' in the original (correct) Daz definition was more a reference to the use in a post to the ambiguously named Nikola rather that part of a definition per se.


Daz
April 05, 2005
I have to admit that taking such ssue with the phrase "being part of the spirit or attitude of the time" as an explanation of zeitgeist is far from hilarious, chocolate. I still wouldn't say it was a misleading explanation of what zeitgeist means but if James LT wants to say that "being part of" isn't actually contained in either of the two words then I'm happy to concede that to him as a piece of ridiculous pedantry since it was abundantly clear to everybody but a retarted squirell monkey what I was saying (which was not a translation anyway). That isn't, however, what you did. You went away, hummed and haaed for ages unable to give an immediate reply, came back with am monumental piece of irrelevance that you'd googled about E*Ging Hegel and "the geist" passing it all off as part of your own knowledge database. This is total bullE*G but utterly typical of your lamentable tatics. Rather than a squirrel monkey you're more like a baboon leaping about, flashing your bright red arse, cackling for no apparent reason and occasionally pulling back your upper lip in a horrible little snarl.


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
EEG… who merits what on this forum isn’t really up to you, no offence. As for my desperation or otherwise… I would have imagined that in your peculiar non-lap dog way you’d let me live with it seeing as it doesn’t affect you at all. I still fail to see your point… if you actually read my reply to Babu you’ll find that I said the exact same thing that James LT talked about and I'd also said consistently that he was wrong even by his own concise thingy definition before James LT made his erudite and intelligent post ... and I’ve also outlined my position to Mcquilkie… so please give it a rest you non-lap dog. Just because you’re bored at work, or wherever you are, isn’t reason enough to lecture me on what is an appropriate response to Daz’s hilarious error. Having said that…I must say that you admitting that Daz was wrong is an amazing shock. Has he read your post?! I have nothing more to say on this. Cheers


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Rob K - that is fair enough and I am sensitive to the difficulty of taking on the task you and Niall have kindly offered to do but I am not sure the rules are open to interpretation or to any committee assessment. They are what they are and it is your duty to maintain them. Being honest did you know Steve's rules before I told you?


Daz
April 05, 2005
Sorry, chcocolate, but that won't wash. This isn't an argument about philosophy but about your constant misrepresntation. You told me my defintion was total nonsense. When challenged on why you didn't reply and then came back with a whole lot of guff you had googled about "the geist" being both spirit and mind and God and blah blah blah. Only recently have you come up with the "being part of" arguments. Since I never offered it as a translation it is irrelevant and was clearly not the main point as anybody but a wilfully stupid person would see. It means the spirit or the attitude of the time and something or someone can be part of that usually literature or philosophy (something which you actually denied) Everything that has come since is part of your customarily nauseating desire to leap about throwing out guff, misrepresenting people, clinging to absurd pieces of pendantry, throwing in some fairly tasteless references to the Spanish Civil War as point-scoring. I might disagree with Exiled but I know by a million miles who I'd rather sit next to at the football. And in the end, nothing will ever change the fact that you got caught out not only googling but cut-and-pasting the results of your frantic searches and passing them off as your own words...oops sorry...lecture. Sad sad sad.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
And Mr Squirrel Monkey - Apologies for lumping you in with the Chocolates of this world but if you cant work out those simple flaps in the "Meet the Monkeys" exhibit (or alternatively tightrope over the low walls) then I am afraid that is where you stand. You and your lot should be down Camden Market making money out of posing with tourists by now.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Chocolate - JamesLT actually pointed out where Daz was "wrong" and it is clear even to my "lawyerly brain" (just a step up from the squirrel monkey) that the simple mistake did not render his use of the word in any way difficult to understand and certainly in no sense at all merited your intervantion and your frankly ludicrous and desperate analysis of Hegel and the ****ing "Geist"! Had you said what JamesLT said you might have had a point. That you said nothing near it means it is not open to you now to call upon it as some kind of verification of your original ramblings. But if you try hard enough I am sure you can convince yourself (if no-one else) that that is what you were thinking all along. Perhaps copying it and pasting it under your title would be a good start.


Bernard
April 05, 2005
N5er, thanks - that seems pretty mixed use to me.


Rob K
April 05, 2005
Only in UEFA's eyes can Lehmann spontaneously and churlishly throwing his water bottle around equate to the same ban as Morinhio making deliberate public statements about the ref & opposite manager being cheats.


Niall
April 05, 2005
I'd also concur that lap dog was pretty apt there EEG.


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
Lap dog, you? Never surely… you always display an unbiased and fair frame of mind. (**he he he**). Sorry, EEG but light hearted or not - he was WRONG that’s the only point. If your lawyerly brain can’t get to grips with why he was wrong … read James LT’s post. So while you may find it acceptable that doesn’t mean that I have to do so. Furthermore I wasn’t aware that anyone had made you the sole arbiter of standards on this forum and since you were one of the forumites who was banging about “dems da rules” as per Cole/ Anelka…a post that were not only light hearted but correct… Do you actually have a point? I think that just about covers it. The issue is closed as far as I’m concerned. Cheers.


N5er
April 05, 2005
Yeah Queensland Road redevelopment site consists of, a new roadway to be built, in approximately the present position of Queensland Road. To its north of the new road is a multi-purpose building comprising of business, retail and commercial space as well as Arsenal's museum. Four 11 to 14 storey tower blocks are proposed immediately south of the new stadium. The total amount of residential accommodation in this portion of the scheme is 175 units for which there are 137 car parking spaces. At ground and podium levels, there will be a range of business and retail units. To its south is a long serpentine-shaped four storey building, comprising of retail and business accommodation plus a community health facility at ground floor level with residential flats above. Car and bicycle parking is provided at the basement level (accessed from the new access road at the northern portion). The total number amount of residential accommodation in this portion of the scheme is 113 units for which there are 58 car parking spaces. >>>> seems a lucrative site to me.


Rob K
April 05, 2005
EEG - We do intend to moderate the forum as Steve had run it in the past and will try to be tolerant of non football discussions within limits (as this is an Arsenal forum), but since we have had to assume the moderator role we'll be relying on our own interpretation of the rules and not agreeing them by committee.


JamesLT
April 05, 2005
Lehmann has received a two-match European ban from UEFA. An extra incentive for Le Boss to bring in a new keeper?


Bernard
April 05, 2005
N5er, off hand I can't remember the figures for Queensland Road, if anyone had calculated them. But I do remember Nico convincing me that the profitability of the Queensland Road site would be increased by the CPO enabling mixed use of the land, which I believe it does.


Squirel Monkey
April 05, 2005
Bad enough that they use us in experiments but being compared to chocolate gooner is the ultimate humiliation.


N5er
April 05, 2005
Hey fellas, you've got a great little site here but from a part timer can I make an observation? Far too much in fighting, FFS were all gooners here aren't we. There now thats off my chest I'll get back to my finances, maybe you guys like it just the way it is!


steve martin
April 05, 2005
So you are the casue of a refree packing the game in and getting death treats... UEFA basically call you a liar and start throwing around threats of Chelsea being kicked out of the Champs league, but when it come down to it, you get a two match touch lion ban... Then a goalie throws some water at the ref and get a two match ban, and it's UEFA who is in charge of european football, God help the game...


N5er
April 05, 2005
Just looked over my previous figures and the situation as I see it is: 2 deals with Wilson Connolly and Newlon Housing providing min. profitability of 52M and 23M respectively less the 20M already booked! 2 more deals were imminent in the accounts but as yet no announcement on Ofex. These I assume were for the total Lough Rd (after the waste station had been installed) and Drayton Park sites. In addition we had the Queensland Rd/CPO appeal site which at the time was under dispute. And finally we have the Highbury redevelopment site which could provide 115/120M (incl the latest 30M) Happy days!


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
You then jumped up and down and shouted "foul" before spending ages desperately trying to find some support when asked what was wrong. All you could do is find some obscure deeper analysis which was so far removed from the original English use as to be irrelevant AND you attempted to pass it off as part of your own knowledge. Piss poor. But fair play to you. Anyone of higher dignity would have given it up long ago.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Chocolate - At the risk of being called (oh horror of horrors) a "lap-dog" (note the use of quotation marks to signify the original statement came from someone else) this is one of those regular Chocolatarian moments when you think you have the killer point and jump up and down while it seems the rest of us cant really see it. Daz used the term "Zeitgeist" in a light-hearted post in an entirely acceptable way which, to anyone who had heard the word, to not understand required some effort. He was asked to explain what the word meant and gave a perfectly acceptable definition in the context in which it was used (give or take the use of the "part of" which would confuse only someone with brain capacity equivalent to a squirrel monkey).


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
At the risk of being called (oh horror of horrors) a "lap-dog" (note the use of quotation marks to signify the original statement came from someone else) this is one of those regular Chocolatarian moments when you think you have the killer point and jump up and down while it seems the rest of us cant really see it. Daz used the term "Zeitgeist" in a light-hearted post in an entirely acceptable way which, to anyone who had heard the word, to not understand required some effort. He was asked to explain what it meant and again, gave a perfectly acceptable definition in the context in which it was used (give or take the use of the "part of" which would confuse only someone with brain capacity equivalent to a squirrel monkey). You then jumped up and down and shouted "foul" before spending ages desperately trying to find some support when asked what was wrong. All you could do is find some obscure deeper analysis which was so far removed from the original English use AND you attempted to pass it off as part of your own knowledge. Piss poor. But fair play to you. Anyone of higher dignity would have given it up long ago.


Brett
April 05, 2005
Jens Lehmann has been banned for 2 UEFA matches for throwing water. Definitely time to get a new goalie, me thinks.


N5er
April 05, 2005
yeah where is the terrier when you need him? Hes not been on AOL much lately either? That Edelman quote rings a bell now. Off the top of your head can you remember what the Queensland Rd profit was likely to be? I had always been fairly conservative because I thought there was a good chance we'd come unstuck and lose that leg. From memory it was thought to be one of the most lucrative parts of the whole deal, am i right?


david.d
April 05, 2005
non topic arsenal question. i apologise in advance but has anyone on here been watching THE CONTENDER on ITV2?. its a boxing reality programme with 16 middleweight contenders all fighting for a million dollar prize and a shot at a world title fight. brilliant programme. anyone seen it?


Bernard
April 05, 2005
N5er, Edelman explicitly said that at the AGM last October. He said at the time it would increase profits by £30 million, though that calculation was presumably based on 557 flats being built, not 711. I don't think any of us has re-calculated what difference all this may mean. Where's Yorkshire?


N5er
April 05, 2005
Re ISCA yeah thats why I fired off my cheeky email to them? ;_)


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
I was interested in this bit from isca's reply: "I cannot say whether the ISCA site will be updated, although it is likely to remain for some time as a record for the benefit of its principal users, who are students of sports geography." Says a lot really.


N5er
April 05, 2005
No doubt the changes have been motivated by likely increase in profitability but maybe they have also taken into consideration expressions of interest in the project!?! Been a while since I was here on a semi regular basis but now that all 3 redevelopment sites have been basically given the go ahead has anyone done any latest calcs as to what the overall profitability will be? And did I read recently that Edelman says the club is considering redeveloping Highbury itself so as to maximise profits?


mcquilkie
April 05, 2005
On, alright then. Unless I'm plagiarising inaccurately, Lauren's contribution to Cameroon's appearance at France 98 was six minutes on the field and one red card. Well, it seemed interesting when I read it.


Bernard
April 05, 2005
N5er, I also noted that ISCA haven't updated their website since 10 December 2004, so they haven't bothered reporting the CPO appeal decision of 18 January 2005, nor that the Queensland Road landowners are not re-appealing. I've noticed before that they ignore what they consider bad news.


Bernard
April 05, 2005
N5er thanks for that link. Notice they're applying to build 711 flats at Highbury instead of the 557 previously approved, meaning there'll be more 1 bedroom units and fewer 2, 3 and 4 bedroom units. Clearly the average price obtained for each property will thus fall, but I wonder if the overall income (or profit) will increase as a result of there being an increase of 154 units? And if so, by how much?


Daz
April 05, 2005
Well let's hope so.


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
Yaaaawn. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
I always thing this Henry/Reyes thing is blown out of proportion, but if there is truth in it then surely Thierry Henry with his much professed love of Arsenal should do what's in the clubs best interest and encourage this wonderful young talent to be the best he can, AT HIGHBURY.


Daz
April 05, 2005
It's like watching roadkill. For the record, I didn't say anything of the sort, chocolate and you got your own information on favela chic from a Guardian music review which at least at the time you credited. I don't have a problem with you googling - I just think it's funny when you so blatantly do it about football - all that stuff about world football and Il Trap was obvious googling the minute somebody disagreed with you. Not to find instant informationor resolve a doubt like which clubs a player has been at or where he was born but to suggest that this information was part of your enormous library of knowledge about world football. In this particular case, you started flailing around madly and then you googled for back up and cut and pasted a whole bunch of irrevlant material to a fairly simple discussion. All you'd have had to say was "being part of" is not contained in the words "zeit" or "geist" actually and I'd have thought you were a tiresome little pedant but I'd have said yes, true, but the essential thing is spirit or attitude of the time which something can obviously be a part of and which I repeated about fifty times. One of the reasons I'll make no apologies for not letting this drop with you is that it is symptomatic of your approach to everything including football. So this isn't a ddebate about "zeitgeist" or philosophy but about the way you operate. You screech, you harrangue, you wriggle, you misrepresent what people say, you ask irrelevant mocking questions, then you spray out a huge cloud of noxious guff to obscure the original issue. All irritating but not as blatant as shameless plagiarising. Do you want to quibble with the defintiion of that because I undertand it as taking somebody elses words and passing them off as your own. You got found out and now you're doing the usual spray the target routine.


Mee
April 05, 2005
If the TH14 v JAR relationship has descended to a level which is having an effect on the teams overall performance would it not be prudent for Wenger to open the RM door even wider? The problem will most likely be resolved this summer anyway, but if Reyes should stay, will we be risking Henry’s future at the club? Given his status at the club, surely everything must be done to keep TH happy. It‘s a pity it isn’t working out because I have a feeling that Reyes’ true potential will be realised somewhere else.


N5er
April 05, 2005
Bernard nothing new on the Queensland Rd sites on the Islington Council website but there is an update on the resubmitted Highbury redevelopment at http://www.islington.gov.uk/Environment/Planning/MajorSchemes/ArsenalStadium/HighburyScheme2005/ Things seem to be moving fast now and its good to see that we will have continuing property related income streams into the early 2010s


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
Mcquilkie… even going by the definition as used by the English … he was still WRONG! That’s the hilarious point. The deeper meaning of the word is just one I’d have expected him to know… given his much-vaunted education. Cheers


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
The reason that Daz would like to give the idea of “googling” or using the net to find information to you and me a pejorative meaning is simple enough… he doesn’t want anyone to investigate anything he might say. Middle class Brazilians will never enter a Favela according to Daz… except that lots middle class Brazilians apparently go to some Favelas at night!… to party!! The only act of Plaigrism I recall on this forum was done by you… when you deliberately and consciously sought to pass off someone else’s piss poor wit as your own. Any way you’re only up to your old tricks… you’ve been whacked on another issue… so with all the intellectual honesty for which you’re famed, you raise a smoke screen. You didn’t know what ‘Zeitgeist’ meant. Period. The end.


Daz
April 05, 2005
Odd though that after "here's a free lecture" you omit those critical words after "which I googled from Hegel.Net" Because back in the day when I was a humble teacher I wrote my own lectures. Not sure what my poor old girlfriend has to do with any of this - she's always urging me to stop playing with the invisible people.


Cannon Balls
April 05, 2005
Bodies, i am with you on that rating for the Village it was well made and acted, but a little too 'arty-stagey' for my more sophisticated tastes!. A good list of movies therethat you list, one that i can highly recommend because it is top-draw is - Frailty -about a serial-killer, not for the squeamish - but also an intelligent well written and made movie. If you have not seen it have a look you will not be disappointed. Emilys movie about the passionate Gooners and neanderthal Spuds supporters meeting up around Finsbury Park station to discuss the match could eclipse the Texas Chain Saw Massacre for hideousness!, especially if the Spuds get roasted. Which taking account of their away form looks likely.


Daz
April 05, 2005
But I'm happy not to get ina willy-waving contest with you - the roads to Cornwall would - I'm sure - be packed again to see the total eclipse of the sun when you unleashed the trusty pork sword of truth.


mcquilkie
April 05, 2005
I know I'll regret posting on this, but I'm not sure why Chocolate keeps going on about the meaning of 'geist', as known by the German populace. From my limited understanding I thought the argument was about the English use of 'zeitgeist'. Now, a football question. Does anyone know what was unusual about Lauren's contribution to Cameroon's France 98 World Cup finals campaign?


Daz
April 05, 2005
Somebody from your corner should really do the honourable thing and throw in the towel. You're a shameless googler and plagiariser. All the guff and red herrings in the world won't change that.


Bernard
April 05, 2005
N5er, thanks. Yes I would have expected the club to submit a new planning application, so it may well be that the timescale will be extended beyond March 2009 to 2010. I assume ISCA will disband, as there's now no real need for their continuation (according to their own aims), I would have thought. When the bill comes in that website owners have to pay (who's paying it for this site), I'd imagine that would be the end of their red card site, though I could be mistaken.


Xav T
April 05, 2005
American, yes I thoroughly enjoyed last night’s match. Seen 8 first teamers in action (including Bentley) for free! Great! I agree with Alex. Cregg and Skulasson were the main reason why we did not win 10-0 last night. They were slowing down the game, when you had Quincy, Ali and RvP running at full speed in front of them. Birchall was a bit more convincing when he came on. Not so sure about Larsson though, he took his goal well enough but to be fair, Robin served it on a platter for him. I’m with Eskimo here, there is so much quality in front of him, I can’t see him gaining a regular spot in our first team anytime soon. The night before I flew to Asia, I saw the Arsenal-Chelsea Reserve game, and for me the star of the show that night was definitely Aliadiere. Scoring his hat trick with aplomb, pace and a lot of technical brilliance. Last night was no different. His first was a true poacher goal (being at the right place at the right time), his second showing off his technical skills. What surprised me was his work rate and the understanding he had with his team mates (mostly in the second half – he had a couple of stray passes in the first). I really hope AW gives him a chance. Quincy was the other star of the night (he created two brilliant goals with his pace), however his passing let him down at times. RvP, full of tricks and should have scored a couple more goals. When he came on, Arturo tried to get on the act and should have scored when he ran to the ball, past the keeper to an open goal 5 yards away, but inexplicably failed to connect properly. This is strange. Is he feeling the pressure of going down in the picking order behind Quincy and Ali? Is the first half of the FA cup game against Sheffield still on his mind? I don’t know. It would be good if he could find his earlier form again. As far as the back line is concerned, not sure how we can judge Almunia on this game. Apart from a couple of well kept saves, he had nothing much to do (Norwich was very poor) . The defence of Sol and Djourou in front of him was impeccable. Good to see Sol back in, and to hear him marshalling Clichy and Djourou (that’s one of the good things about reserve games, you can actually hear the players talking/shouting at each other). Obviously he was imperial in defence. His team mates were giving him the ball quite a lot, so he did have some misplaced passes (as you would expect) but overall he did quite well. Djourou was impressive too (I guess it’s easier to do so alongside someone like Sol who you know is here to cover any of your potential mistake) a lot more than the couple of previous occasions I saw him play. Clichy was excellent (yet again). Brilliant in defense (Bentley never got one over him. It must have been so frustrating for the poor David, who was so clearly so much better than the rest of his team mates!), and in attack when he combined several times with Quincy, Cregg, Ali and RvP. Eboue was not too bad either. Kept his right side impeccably, and also joined in the attack (he created the first goal very impressively). He definitely offers a lot more than Lauren going forward, so I would not mind seeing him promoted. Unfortunately, this was the last home game of the season, but I am really looking forward to seeing again all these guys in the first team soon.


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
Ladies and gentlemen I give you the quote in context.… I seem to have struck a particularly raw nerveso here’s a free lecture…'Geist' is a German word which has all the meanings of the English words: spirit, mind, soul and the French word, esprit. German language makes no distinction between spirit and mind: for both, Germans use the same word, 'Geist'. While 'Geist' is usually translated either as spirit or mind the English reader is perhaps well-advised to think of 'Geist' as both together, e.g. Spirit/Mind. Now here is what Daz said…” I’m clearly comparing an authoritative source with Daz’s rubbish… please note the introduction which talks of a free lecture and also note that I left in a phrase.. “the English reader” which is clearly intended to show the didactic nature of the post… a fact that Daz incidentally picked up. If I was trying to hide the fact that it was a quote I wouldn’t have left that in…. Compare that to Daz lifting, verbatim, an address by Jonathan Aitken and just adding chocolate before the word sword…. And when he was praised for it… he accepted the praise. So once again the rules are different for Daz and different for anyone else…. Yep, I’m writing an University essay not posting a reply on a football forum? Pathetic. Dishonesty??? You’re the champion mate. 1) There’s nothing wrong with using the net as a source of information as long as the information is correct. Correctly used and as long as you know what you’re talking about those are the only issues. 2) Any one who claims to have done even an Introductory Philosophy course will know about the concept of the ‘Geist’ and the ‘Zeitgeist’ and their link to Hegel. It is absolutely not deep or profound knowledge that you can only discover on an obscure website. The Oxford Companion to Philosophy, which is a fairly ordinary reference book explains the concept and guess what? It’s entry on Hegel is only about 7 pages long!! I’m sure that even a “Hegel for beginners” pamphlet will explain it… so the question is: why doesn’t someone who claims to be educated up to eyeballs and who wanted to start a debate about Pre-Socratic philosophy not know about such a basic idea in European philosophy? 3) I refuse to get into a willy waving contest about who has what qualifications or whether my wife works in an inner city comprehensive, as a social worker, a nurse or whether she works in the socially rewarding, entirely useful, morally pure and life enhancing world of television. Such things are irrelevant and tell you nothing. Cheers all. ... ... ... ... ... ... Västerås Gooner, there is no big deal, just a load of perjorative nonsense by a monumental prat. cheers.


N5er
April 05, 2005
Bernard re the CPO appeal. I sent an email off to ISCA recently and got the following reply: >>As widely reported in the press the businesses lost their case in the HighCourt. We have been waiting to see whether they would appeal. It appears not as they are now out of time.AFC therefore control all the land they wanted. The only new developments are new planning applications to increase the density of the Highbury Stadium site and extend the timescale to 2010, and a redesign of the Northern Bridge Building to increase it size to house AFC administrativeoffices. Details from Islington council website, planning pages or www.highburycommunity.org.So far there are no public details of the developer's intentions concerning the Queensland Road area, which is only in outline and unlikely to be built as currently consented.I cannot say whether the ISCA site will be updated, although it is likely to remain for some time as a record for the benefit of its principal users, who are students of sports geography. isca_2000@hotmail.com Original messageTo: Sent: Saturday, March 26, 2005 6:55 AM Subject: ISCA > So whats the latest or is it dead in the water? Are you going to update your website?


Västerås Gooner
April 05, 2005
Daz, lol!


bubblechris
phanoschristoforou@hotmail.com
April 05, 2005
Alex - I thought Almunia had a good game too, he did what he had to do and there were none of the nerves and shakiness he showed when playing for the first team.Andy in Singapore - I think they've renamed it the white bear I'll check next time i go past and let you know. If you haven't got any contacts in Broxbourne or surrounding areas i could take some pics and email them to you, let me know.


Daz
April 05, 2005
Brilliant! I'll get one of my mates to give up his ticket and chocolate and I can go and sit together. Emily can film our passionate chats during the game - I expect we'll be riffing around topics like the social mix in Brazilian favelas, the meaning of zeitgeist and ways of concealing blatant plagiarism - and I promise to send it back to the forum where it can be archived in a special lead-lined off-topic secure chatrrom.


Daz
April 05, 2005
Well maybe de rules are different in Vasteras, Vasteras but it is usually considered to be plagiarism. You would either credit your source or put it in inverted commas or preferably both. But chocolate passed it off as his original thinking on the subject, his own words in order - something I have been accused of myself - to make himself look smarter than he actually is.


Emily
egglentine16@hotmail.com
April 05, 2005
Hello all Arsenal Supporters! My name is Emily, I working on behalf of a Camaroonian film maker who will be coming to England next week to make a film comparing football supporters in England and his country, Camaroon for the British Film Council. I am looking for some of the most passionate and dedicated Arsenal supporters to feature in the film who would be required to take part in a couple of interviews and maybe have a very small camera crew follow them for a few hours (must be in the London area sorry!) The match between Arsenal and Tottenham on the 25th april will also be included in the film and ideally we would follow some of the more devoted Arsenal fans to the match and throughout the match.If anybody would be interested in becoming involved in this very exciting film project please please get in touch with me as soon as possible.Remember only the most passionate fans need apply.Thank you for your time, my email address is egglentine16@hotmail.com. Thanks again!


Bernard
April 05, 2005
But Daz, what do you think of the new strut, it's clearly visisble on the west stand. Yorkshire and others interested, I phoned my contact at Islington Council yesterday to ask whether the landowners at Queensland Road had appealed against the decision made in the last CPO appeal, and he said he was seeing the council's lawyer later and would get back to me. He called this morning and it's great news. They haven't appealed, and the lawyer told my contact that it's so long since the last decision was made (18 January, so almost three months), which is so far in excess of the time limit for making a further appeal, any judge would now automatically throw a fresh appeal out. So that's it, the legal challenges are all now completely over. There are a few preliminaries that the council have to do before they serve notice on the landowners for the purchase of the properties, so they won't be bought immediately. But according to Arsenal's timetable for the Queensland Road regeneration, they need the properties in their hands buy January 2006, as that's when the building work there is due to start (and is due to finish in March 2009).


Västerås Gooner
April 05, 2005
What exactly is the big deal if someone cut and paste an answer?


Daz
April 05, 2005
Oh and chocolate, it's like basic undergraduate stuff (dem's de rules) that if you directly lift something (sorry fortuitously stumble across it) you either put it in quotation marks or name your source rather than pass if off as your own stuff. Decaf simply showed that you were a googler (as you are about football), a plagiarist and a total charlatan so well done to him.


Daz
April 05, 2005
See what I mean? It's hard to ignore him (or even IGNORE) him. I don't actually recall anybody pleading with you not to IGNORE me. chocolate on the basis that it was "rude". But go ahead and do it again. And if it makes you feel better, those fatal words "being part of" clearly mean that I had no idea that zeitgeist means the spirit of the time even though I repeated that a hundred times and your objections weren't based on this tiny pedantic issue (I wasn't translating the term) but on stuff you googled and then cut and pasted from an obscure web-site. You're an utter imbecile.


Daz
April 05, 2005
With Niall and I? James BLT you are the Edu of the forum. I'm really enjoying these descriptions of "hate-filled" messages by the way. I don't hate chocolate I just think he's an idiot who cuts and pastes the results of his googling from Hegel.Net. You know how Gooners have a bit of a reputation for going down like a pair of tart's knickers when the going gets tough. I can see why with the sissy behaviour of some on here. If Niall calls me a I don't think it's because he hates me, it's because things sometimes get heated. OK, I had to get physical with Harlow once and it wasn't pretty but he - as everybody knows - is a special case.


chocolate gooner
April 05, 2005
Before I finally sign off from muppet swatting I would like to clarify a few things. I’d like to start by saying that I fully appreciate the irritation that some members of the forum feel with some of the weirder topics we sometimes discuss on this forum especially when they go on for too long, and let me also put my hand up and accept that I’m guilty of debating a point to death… but nevertheless it is truly irritating when an individual who, let me remind you, has set himself up as a superior and rather better educated individual than the rest of us keeps making basic errors that an uneducated and inveterate know-nothing googler like myself keeps showing up. I am grateful to James LT for pointing out the basic issue at the heart of the latest hooha. Basically Daz is and was wrong on what Zeitgeist means… whether you judge him by the higher standard, which given the Philosophy 101 that he says is burning a hole in his brain (watch him use this piece of hyperbole as evidence of 'lying') is what one would expect him to want to be judged by … or even if one chooses to judge him by the concise dictionary thingy.. although, funnily enough, such a dictionary definition proved insufficient as a way of defining ‘Sophism’. Spot the dishonesty. That’s it. The rest is a load of obfuscating twaddle. The only issue is what he said in his initial post - and what he said was wrong no matter how you look at it, not that that is particularly surprising. … … … … Now to Decaf, who has never knowingly answered a question. Here are a few more questions for you not to answer: what do the definitions that you cut and paste prove, exactly? That what I’m saying is correct? Or that I fortuitously stumbled across a definition which reinforced my point… in which case may I suggest that you do likewise and stumble across a website which will confirm that Kant is linked to the dialectical method of antithesis: thesis: synthesis? Why don’t you blindly blunder into a web page that will show you that Kant finished the job of the Sophists? Hey! While you’re at it, may be you can show us a web page which proves the relevance of mentioning Schopenhaur in a discussion about ‘Geist’ or ‘Zeitgeist’. It should be a doddle for you since you lecture South African youngsters. I don’t expect to get an answer to any of those questions but I’m sure that you’ll find another irrelevant bit of nonsense to litter the forum with. The only good thing about your idiotic post is that the bits you cut and paste were understandable, which is a huge improvement on your normal fare…. … … … … … … … … … … Finally since these exchanges do nothing for the forum, or indeed for me, because they aren’t really debates or even proper arguments but just another way for Daz to exhibit his peculiar prattishness… I intend to ignore both Decaf and Daz. Now, I’ve done this before and only ended up with other members of the forum complaining about my rudeness but except someone can come up with a better solution… I’ll just have to scroll past the posts by these two forumites. This isn’t a hissy fit or some such thing but a practical matter of saving my time and reducing the grief I get from other forumites complaining about off-topic issues… and also I could get back to discussing Arsenal, which is why I log on to this forum any way. In addition Steve M won’t be able to complain about me putting poor Daz down… Daz can very well do that job on his own. Cheers all.


Bernard
April 05, 2005
Daz, have a look at the webcam on Arsenal.com quick. It looks very much like there's another strut on the new stadium. It'll look really great when it's finished.


Bodies In The Box
April 05, 2005
Cannon Balls - coincidentally I watched The Village last night. I'd give it a 2.5 out of 5. Sabir - what sort of horrors are you looking for? Chilling ghost stories or slasher films? In the latter category check Black Christmas, Halloween, Nightmare On Elm Street and the best of them all, The Texas Chainsaw Massacre. In the former category try The Woman In Black (if you can get it) and The Devil's Backbone. More recently I enjoyed the film Saw, which I thought was very original.


JamesLT
April 05, 2005
ALEX: Great point on the price we should ask for AC3 and the cost of the Academy... JULIANO: Agree totally on the red and white hooped socks. Pure class. Pure Arsenal. Their return could be just what we need to push on and make a breakthrough in the Champions League next season... NIALL/DAZ: Am I the only one who is savouring the messages backwards and forwards between Niall and Daz? Fill in the asterisks and it could be straight from 'Withnail and I', or maybe make that 'With Niall and I'... "Balls. We want the finest forum available to humanity. We want it here and we want it now."


DHD
April 05, 2005
Looking at my tickets for the Birdge that came through the other week, they're 'only' £40. I'm sure that last year they were quite a bit more expensive - £49?? Can anyone confirm that. Anyone know why?


Parkerknoll Gooner
April 05, 2005
American - he'd be to late, the Russians already bought it! Despite his little hiccup his wealth is still mind boggling and you have to admire what he's done in Africa.


Alex
April 05, 2005
If Cole is sold, we will need at least 24M. That is the ammount that has been spent on the Youth Academy in the last 8 years, and he is all we have to show for it. What is the point in the YA? Will it get better? Who's to blame?


Alex
April 05, 2005
Eskimo- There were few other kicks that went no where near Arsenal shirts as well, which as he was under no pressure, and had nothing else to do, is a little dissapointing from an experienced 'Keeper. Where there any accurate kicks? I agree with you about Laarsen situation. I think that maybe he's a 'dark hoarse', and is worth hanging on to. Maybe he will be a 'late developer' and make the first team yet, you never know. He would make a damn useful player, as I think he has played in most positions this season, and done well in all of them. Surely the fact that he stands out more now is a sign of development? Also, much better choice of hair style, I'm sure you'll agree with that! Fair enough about Quincy, but I really think he's got something. I don't think he's that far off at all. Have you seen much more of Djourou? I haven't been able to see him much. By all accounts Wenger is a big fan. Looked shaky in Carling Cup.


old man of hoy
April 05, 2005
Good to hear that Sol has deigned to play a bit of football again - trust it wasn't too much for him - mind you it is going to be cold this weekend so he may not be ready for an away game at Boro. I did enjoy the recent Gooner back-page sketch of him as The Only Gay in the Village. Just a word of praise for our next striker Michael Owen - the dignified way in which he dealt with Carlos Alberto's outrageous verbal assault made the much lauded Brazilian seem very small in comparison. Am enjoying the Manc wife-beating fans carping about the hike in their season ticket prices - Lord knows how they would cope with the Arsenal or Chelsea pricing structure. I expect the government might offer a subsidy. And Phil did i read right that Daniel Cohn-Bendit is now a parliamentarian? I remember him as Danny the Red from Paris 1968 - a revolutionary socialist intent on hauling down capitalism and all of its institutions. Probably a good mate of Bill Gates now. In a cynical mood i head towards the great centre of London to help my local authority obtain yet more kudos from its citizens. This one for the oldies and Brazil 70. Sadie was divorcing her husband Moshe. After two months of waiting, her case was finally being heard in Court. The judge asked Sadie, "So how old are you?" "I’m 40 years old, your Honour." The judge replied, "Please answer my question honestly. How old are you?" "I’m 40 years old, your Honour," answered Sadie again. "Well," said the judge, "you’re not being truthful. It’s written down here that you were born in August 1940 and that means you’re over 60." "But your Honour," replied Sadie, "I’m not counting the last 20 years with my husband." "Why not?" asked the judge. "You call that living?" replied Sadie.


Eskimo
April 05, 2005
Alex - Are you talking about the one kick straight off the pitch from Almunia (when Larsson was free and calling for the ball), because apart from that, I don't remember any poor kicking (not that he had that much to do!). Larsson has been consistently good for the reserves for a long time, he is just easy to forget when you have players like Aliadiere and Quincy playing alongside him. I must say though, I have absolutely no idea what the manager thinks of him, who he's behind and ahead of or if he'll ever make it a THOF. Been on the bench for the Champions League a few times though (if I'm not mistaken), but with our squad size, that's not always an indication of who will make it and who won't. Quincy is not world class (yet), don't get people's hopes up!


Andy In Singapore
April 05, 2005
Sorry for the non football post but the talk of the Anne of Cleaves pub brought memories flooding back as I grew up in Broxbourne. The Anne Of Cleaves was originally the White Bear pub and it was opposite a youth club called the Mustard Pot where I had my first ciggie, drink and snog (not at the same time). To add some football relevence Pat Jennings, Willie Young, Dave O'Leary and a few other Spurs and Arsenal players lived in Broxbourne at the time in the days before footballers could afford Hampstead. FPTBAG.


Alex
April 05, 2005
Saw the second half of the reserves game tonight. Norwich looked much like there first team counterparts. Almunia is not showing any signs of improvement, his kicking was worse than Taylor's, and that is more or less all he had to do. Campbell and Djourou also had little to do, but Djourou did seem classy, and Campbell came through unscathed. Clichy was great as usual, and Eboue was not at all far behind. Agree with previous posting that Wenger intends to break him in slowly next season, with Hoyte as No. 2. Maybe that's why he only wanted to give Lauren 1 more year. Disagree with previous posting, Skulasson was out of his depth, as was Cregg, but at least he's a little younger. Laarsen has improved the most in the reserves this season. He looked like nothing special in pre-season, but now is holding his own with the likes of V.Persie, Quincy, and Aliadiere etc. That is probably why he had his first call up for the Swedish U21's this season. Forget Reyes, Quincy is world class, and could turn out as good as Henry. Didn't seem to get out of first gear, but tore the Norwich defence open on a whim. Also hope Aliadiere and Lupoli stick around, as they are both top draw, and V.Persie is very near being a first team regular. Bentley looked fatigued, which is not a surprise as it was his first game back. Lets see what he does next year. I have never seen a player so fluent with both feet, that's for sure. Maybe 2 signings in the summer really will be enough!


Wengerknows
April 05, 2005
PG - And he's promised his kids no more than 10m each in his will. Miser !!! I bet they'd rather have Abramovich for a dad. Have to agree that having an off-topic forum will reduce the quality of this forum. God invented scrolling for when the forum get's tedious. As a famous man once said I may not like what you say (or come to think of it, how you say it) but I'll defend your right to do so. The scope of debate is part of what makes Steve's forum different and special. Propers to Niall, Rob and Roger for taking on the thankless task of policing. It's why we respected Steve so much. PTBAG.


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
Pakerknoll Gooner, we may have to pass the hat for Bill. Before the tech bubble his estimated net worth was about 100 billion dollars give or take a few cents. Now its closer to 50 billion. Buy an excutive box? Ha! He could buy the league.


Parkerknoll Gooner
April 05, 2005
American - I read an interesting fact about your compatriot Bill Gates concerning his personal wealth. Some wag wanted to know if Gates hid all his money under his mattress how long would it take him to hit the floor if he fell out of bed. It was calculated in GBP and they used £10 notes under a single mattress and they figured it would take him 30 seconds to hit ground zero, if they'd used 1 dollar bills my rough calculation is it would take approx. 7 minutes. In addition at current UK rates he earns £3.4m a day in interest alone! Someone should offer him an executive box at AG and get him hooked, he makes the Russian look like a pauper.


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
It will be very interesting to see how Mourinho reacts when the club form suffers. He likes to pout. Right now, Fergie hasn't unleashed his full repertoire of mind games and needling that he likes to do. A little so far this year (they'll have to win up north for example) but even Fergie can see the writing on the wall for this season. Everything, decisions, luck, no injuries, is going Chelsea's way but he'll pounce when he sniffs out an opportunity. Wenger is more subtle with his. He's learned a thing or two from Fergie. Right now, he gives good quotes for the back pages and the press is glad there is something to talk about other than Arsenal and Man Yoo, but we'll see next season (or even sometime in the remainder of games). If he gets Gerrard and Adriano and other players, spends tens of millions of rubles again and doesn't win, it will all go pear shaped. Chelsea is a gilded cage. Once they win the title they have to repeat. We never had their kind of money or even Man Yoo's so we were always seen as playing way above our financial situation. Given Chelsea's financial strength which dwarfs even Man Yoo the press will be less kind in any weakness they exhibit. Its going to be fun.


Mee
April 05, 2005
Brazil 70: I wasn’t aware that England were ever considered a major international football power post 1966, despite the 1970 teams best efforts. The Dutch team of 1974 - losers in the world cup final of that year, were the finest team in the tournament, as were the great Hungarian team, losers to Germany in the world cup final of that year in 1954. Time and reputation decide the great teams, not the trophy cabinet.


Brazil 70
April 05, 2005
Mee-that sounds a very English attitude to winning.If England had not won in 1966 (dodgy goals or not)the country would have no claim whatsoever to being a major international football power.In any event the national team must share your view as they have been good losers at every tournament since then.I would like to say more, but cannot be seen discussing the glories of 1966.


Mee
April 05, 2005
Wirrall G/ Brazil 70: I offer this match as a counter argument to those who say the game is only about winning. The Brazil team team of 1970 are generally recognised as one of the finest international teams ever. Their 1-0 victory against England in the World Cup was significant because it gave England the opportunity to produce their finest ever performance. The scoreline flattered Brazil and even Pele suggested a draw would have been a fairer result. If you study a tape of that game, you will see that England more than matched their hosts - an incredible feat when you consider the temperature at midday when the game was played. The game is chiefly memorable from an English standpoint because of Gordon Banks save from Pele and Jeff Astles ghastly miss. Alf Ramsay himself considered this to be Englands finest performance, eclipsing the 66 final win over W. Germany. For the first twenty minutes of this game the passing and movement of the England team simply took the breath away, it certainly surprised the Brazilians. I take more satisfaction from this defeat than the victory in 66.


Cannon Balls
April 05, 2005
American,it will be tougher for Mourinho next season if he is still at the bridge that is,and that's not so certain with a flakey character like him when something upsets him. There was a certain amount of good-fortune involved at crucial times this season, Robben coming in when they were struggling for goals and old Mother Riley handing them the title with his decisions at OT against us and at Anfield when they should have been beaten over Christmas. Next season the big decsions could go against him, thats how it is in football,and we should know better than most!.


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
There are reports that Mourinho is very upset at the supposed lack of support from Chelsea over his recent problems. Frankly, how can you excuse the excusable? While I don't think there is much truth in his leaving and he'll stay. However, he is showing cracks in his demeanor. He's avoiding the press. Our board and Wenger were more honorable over the handbags at OT issue and accepted humbly the punishment the FA handed down. Chelsea could learn a thing or two. Anyway, its getting obvious that Mourinho can't stand the heat that the press in England is lighting under him. Next season I fully expect them to have a slip and I don't think they'll win the title. I think we'll be back to our best. Everyone healthy, and with 2 or 3 good buys in the summer we'll be our formidable selves again. When he is unable to get the title and the pressure is on, I wonder how he'll take it? If he wins this season, he'd have won the title his first 3 years as manager (He didn't manage before Porto, right?). How will he react to it when it doesn't go his way? I can see Chelsea already has a ready excuse if they go out against BM.


Richie
April 05, 2005
Supermac as he was known was signed for a record fee, £333,333,33. One of the fastest players around as demonstrated on the Superstars programme, winning the 100 metres at a blistering pace. Formed a decent partnership with Stapleton. One of the highlights was a 5-3 win over Newcastle with Mac bagging a hat-trick against his former club. The '78 Cup Final should have been his stage after being a previous loser in '74. Alas, he was carrying an injury and it showed I am afraid. He was to miss out on the '79 final also. Very much a traditional centre forward and a firm favourite with the fans. Sadly, finally succumbed to a knee injury and forced to quit the game at 29 I think. Sad end to a colourful career.


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
Thanks for the report bubblechris, I envy supporters like yourself, Xav T, Eskimo and others who go to those games regularly. CB, I agree. My fear though is if they only need a draw. Then if we play great but still draw they can celebrate in front of us. I couldn't enjoy our title winning game last season because I wanted a win (which we fully deserved) over Spurs as well. The title was anti-climatic because of Lehmann. You're right though, we need that win. We'll be at full strength as well. We should have 4 goals as a team for the rest of the season.1) Runner up in the league at a minimum 2) Beat Chelsea. 3) Win the FA cup and 4) End the season with no more defeats. ***** Exiled, great post. Thanks for posting that info here. Nothing about his heading though? hahaha..joking...his goal v. Blackburn should give everyone a smidgen of how good he can be. Hhis goal celebration has to be changed though, only Rob Keane's is worse. **** Question for the forum. Will the Chelsea game eclipse the Man Yoo game as our game of the season? (as well as for neutrals?). Right now, the press views us and Man Yoo, will it change next season?


Genève Gooner
April 05, 2005
Leave the forum as it is. We can all scroll up and down if something doesn't interest us. An off topic forum? Why not just add a link to the BBC, Guardian, Independent or whatever forums? (a ghetto?). Some of the 'on-topic' messages can be fairly tedious for a lot of us but, again, we have the choice to read them or not. There is a reason why so many people have read (and posted on) this forum for so long. Please don't destroy it.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
Happy to help.


Brazil 70
April 05, 2005
Exiled-Thanks for the wake up call.I found myself sliding into unrestrained nostalgia just then (& rather worryingly beginning to enjoy it).I am o.k now though & ready to face the future.


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
As much as I hate to admit it, even as an oldie. I agree with the sentiments expressed by Braz 70.much better to win at all costs than to play brilliantly and fail. indeed i did not sleep after manure game it still depresses me now. But i still have my memories of historical triumphs to cheer me up.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
Oi! Brazil70... stop talking about the Brazil team of 1970 - you don't like it (insert silly smiley here).


Brazil 70
April 05, 2005
East End Gooner-I was being honest about my view that I like beautiful football but at a raw emotional level, like winning more.Losing some games can be physically painful e.g this seasons loss at Manu when we lost the unbeaten record.I did not sleep that night dwelling on what could have been (another example of the dangers of looking back?JOKE ).I always feel depressed after a defeat , pretty cheerful after an ugly/lucky win & ecstatic after a beautiful win.Playing really well but losing is frankly not much consolation.If the Brazil team of 1970 had just played pretty football & not won anything they would just be another Columbia.I thought some of the recent responses to my comments on not being interested in "old football" quite amusing.Moreover my suspicion that I am in a minority in finding it boring seems to be confirmed.


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
Re Malcolm macdonald. signed from the barcodes for £333,333.33p in summer of 1976. 1976 - 1977 41 games with 25 goals.1977 - 78 39 games with 15 goals.1978 - 1979 4 games with 2 goals.famous for hat trick against barcodes on 4 12 76 in AFC 5 - 2 victory at Arsenal Stadium.


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
Re Malcolom Macdonald. he was crocked by Terry Daracott an Everton fullback of very little skill. It totally wrecked his knee. he played at the back end of 1978. He played 4 times in 1978 79 season scoring 2 goals. Everton game was 26 08 78. His next and last game was chelski on 14 05 79 after the manure fa cup final. He scored against chelski.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
One of the Dutch posters on Mania put this up and thought it might be of interest.....Steve Rowley said some very positive things about Robin van Persie in a Dutch newspaper. I translate it a little bit. Sorry if I made some mistakes He doesn't understand why Robin has a bad reputation in Holland. He's a fantastic player who has to learn a few things. He has a great future. Everyone at the club believes that he's a big talent. Arsène Wenger says that his technique is unprecedented high. Also outside the field they have no doubt about him. He lives 7 days a week for the football. They know that he doesn't go to a nightclub and that he only exercice, eat en sleep. (They have a spy in the Londen nightlife) If we compare him with how he was when he came the first time at Arsenal, he made a big progress. Robin is a lovely, happy boy. He comes every day with a smile to Arsenal. He exercise very hard every day and he has a nice personality. He's a happy go luck-type. Everybody loves him. We care very good for him. He gets attention and support. Arsène Wenger knows that he has the decency to learn. Robin is a lunatic when it goes about football. If he's at home, he only watch football. We give him tapes of his own matches. He often asks for that tapes. He loves it. We have a welfare officer (Paul Irwin) who helps Robin with his problems but most of the time he solves his problems by himself. He is independent and we praise him for that. He has a lovely wife who cares fine for him. Bouchra is a wise person and he can trust her. The only thing that Robin has to do, is to play fantastic football.


GunGun
April 05, 2005
I am relieved that most forumites enjoy the history stories and am also pleased that the form of conduct is being discussed. Some mails are too bitchy and personal. I guess we can all take that but the danger is that the forum slowly degenerates into a hate-page and personal dirt-slinging contest. I think Niall is doing a good job and should not be told what to do. Don`t be intimidated by anyone Niall. Good work, man.Who can tell me a bit about Malcolm MacDonalds time at Highbur`? His name is very rarely mentioned but he was a big star at Newcastle before he joined us and even played a few times for England. What went wreong at Highbury?


Cannon Balls
April 05, 2005
American,we should welcome with open arms that the Chelsea game is the one where they can win the title. What a great chance to put our marker down for next season by beating them on their own ground!.That would be twice that they have failed to win against us this season - in their best ever one and when winning the title with a record number of points. A psychological blow that Mourinho will not relish if it happens. And it can - our record against them at the Bridge is very good - and with our missing players back - Sol played tonight in a reserve match - we can pull it off.


bubblechris
April 05, 2005
Reserves beat Norwich reserves 4-0. Alliadiere(2) Van Persie & Larrson. Excellent vicyory dominated all the way through, well would you expect less Sol, VP, Quincy, Eboue, Aliadierre, were all excellent. Skullason was all over the plce and had a great game while David Bentley must be wishing he was wearing the red of the Gunners. He had some lovely touches but was in a team well out of its depth. Cant wait for the Spurs reserves game at Stevenage next Monday week.


Chippys Chisler
April 05, 2005
I have enjoyed the history lessons on this site recently, as an overseas supporter who came to the Gunners in '71, the history is what makes our club different. Chelski can buy the league but they will never buy our history or tradition and that really annoys them. Embrace history its part of what we are.


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
CB, I have seen the movie. That director is from Philadelphia and all his movies are in or near Philly. Good, analogy though. **** Its possible for Chelsea to win the title at our expense against us. Under no circumstances should we let that happen. That game has to be played like a cup final so that, that scenario doesn't come to fruition. Imagine the Blues and spuds fans having a laugh if that happened? Perish the thought!!**** I know he won't get it, but Fabregas' name should at least be mentioned amongst the final 2 or 3 players for the young player of the year award. We all know Lamps will get the player of the year award. Everyone will view it as Chelsea's year. However, I do not think Mourinho should get the manager of the year. It should Moyes, no matter where they finish. 4th place in April with what he has to work with and his 'best' player sold and his big buy (Beattie) a bust so far and they're still in it, after being labeled relegation candidates in preseason, deserves manager of the year. Mourinho has done a good job. Not denying it, but its like giving who ever takes over Microsoft after Bill Gates leaves as being CEO of the year. As I've often said, there are half a dozen PL managers that could win the title if they managed Chelsea.


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
Cannon Balls is right. You must never forget your past. Thats what makes AFC special, the tradition and history that us oldies were brought up on. My late dad would tell me tales about Wilf Copping and how Hulme,Jack,Drake,James and Bastin were the greatest ever forward line in history. It is stuff like this that makes us proud to say the name.By the way the Valencia game was the day before my birthday. I cried when Brady and Rix missed their penalties.The WHU final was my brothers birthday. It was a shit week for us. Never forget the low points they make the highs even greater


Decaf
April 05, 2005
Old timers, keep it up. I enjoy your posts immensely. What Brazil 1970, the anti-intellectual brigade, and the clinically impersonal Chocolate Gooner do not realise is that football clubs are about the people who support them. EEG, I agree that the subject of moderation, like any other, should be open to debate. One more thing: Steve M, and the growing brigade of those who were converted during his absence, wanted Gilberto to have a good game, and, hey presto, he gets glowing reports, and the second coming is confirmed. No doubt the same performance a few months ago, when people were getting a bit tired of the invisibility of invisible shield, would have drawn sharp criticism. Context and nuance.


Juliano
April 05, 2005
Worst Arsenal kit has to be the half blue/half green 96/97 away kit, with the two halves separated by a kind of lightning. that was really dreadful. That and the very first "O2" away kit, light blue torso, navy sleeves with some touches of red. Atrocious, that is the word. But who am I to argue, as a self confessed nostalgic of the hooped socks! Without being homosexual, Dennis look great in those!


Cannon Balls
April 05, 2005
American, have you seen the 'The Village' .Not an out and out horror film but sort of scary about people living in a remote Village and terrified of leaving it because of strange creatures living in the surrounding woods. Sounds rather like living in certain areas of North London with Spuds supporters surrounding you!.


Daz
April 05, 2005
That means a lot to me, American. Thanks.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
I was going to say something about the Norwich game but not sure I should. As it's in the past isn't it now history? That's how daft it is.


Cannon Balls
April 05, 2005
Unless someone is living in a parallel world to this with no past ony the present then it is difficult to see how you can avoid history.Traditions and history play a large part in football and always will.Some people may suppose that the history only begins when they decide to support a club for whatever reason.To be brutally realistic it's usually down to the success or history of the club. United have attracted supporters in the past because of the history of the club during the Busby-Best era, and likewise Arsenal and Liverpool for our pasts. Tottenham live on their past history and if it were to be discounted,what would they replace it with ?, you can only marvel at the Robbie Keane goal celebration so many times. I can't see any problem with suporters discussing the history of their club or refering to others after all that's what football is about - not just watching but talking about it also. And i do not go along with the idea that the past is not relevant to the present time in football, we can learn alot from the past, remember the old saying,those that do not learn from the mistakes of their history are doomed to relive them. Like for instance practising for a penalty shoot-out,we were hopeless at it for years even Wenger losing the Uefa Cup Final in 2000 on one to go with the one we lost to Valencia in the 1980 Euro Cup Winners Final.


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
I don't mind the non footie stuff. We've had some very in depth discussions on politics, religion and philosophy. They can go on too long, but so can certain football related debates (Ljundberg v. Wiltord for example). For me, its the personal attacks. Not against my person so much but the ones that seem completely filled of hatred. Saying 'you're crazy if you think such and such would be good for Arsenal' is not what I'm talking about. Basicaly hatred shown to each other the way I hate Fergie and Man Yoo. hehehe. **** Thanks Gun Gun. You wouldn't have thought I was knowledgeable when I wanted Saha to come to Arsenal ;- )...I am not looking for anyone banned (unless you post under someone else's name and violate any existing rules of conduct). Just saying what I think needed to be said. **** Mee, I would still like Everton to get 4th. First, because it would be a club other than Chelsea, Man Yoo, LFC or Newcastle. And second, they remind me of the kind of grit and fight that attracted me to the english game in the first place and they're doing it without any stars or flair players. Its refreshing in a way to see a club like Everton still 4th at this time of the season. It gives other similar clubs hope. **** I'm still very surprised Barry Martin (and others) who are laying the primary blame on Norwich's goal on anyone other than Pires. Lehmann shares in the blame, Gilberto shares in the blame for ducking, but its minor compared to Pires' complete and utter indifference near his own box while defending the opponent's most dangerous player. Lehmann's flapping and Gilberto's ducking would have been moot had Pires done his job. Also, Lehmann was back in position for the strike, but he had no chance. It came in with so much force at a close range and not made easy to stop being screened by Gilberto who ducked out of the way. Also, he had a man on the line and the ball came too high and fast. Lehmann had no chance once the ball was struck. **** Niall and Daz, I'm having some fun picturing you both in my mind's eye holding hands singing...kumbayah...my lord...kumbayah....lol. Class of you e email him Niall, Daz...well...hmmm, I don't want you banned. That's the best I can do when commenting about you. ;-)


AmericanGooner
April 05, 2005
Solman, while I completely emphasize with your frustration with Reyes, I do think that he can make it. If he never had an impact, I would agree but last season around this time and September tells me he can. He was good enough in September, do you agree? He was still over running the ball and getting pushed off the ball then. I wouldn't want to see him go so soon. I'd still like another year from him at least. **** I've asked before but do not recall any one offering an answer. Which of the two (Beckenbauer or Platini) is favored to win the presidency? **** Exiled In Newcastle, are you sure the police there are not using the NYC police handbook?


Sabir
April 05, 2005
It'll be interesting to see who gets the player of the year awards. A lot of people are saying Terry (he has been immense). I've also heard Robben and Cech. Not sure if Robben's played enough, but the three of them have had a huge impact. Henry's stats alone qualify him to be challenging. I don't think he will win it this year, but if that was anyone else with the same stats, they'd probably win it. Gilberto's performance, in fact the team's performance, needs to be kept in perspective as it was only Norwich but at the same time, we're entitled to enjoy ourselves. It was a fab result and a great day all round. Personally I can appreciate Gilberto and in my opinion, he does offer some solidity to the team. He's strong and athletic, intercepts well and has aerial ability. But if you're looking for him to really catch your eye - wrong man. I always thought he was ideal for some games and Edu was better suited to others. It's like Flamini and Fabregas. You'd play Flamini against the physical teams. Off topic - Any recommendations for good Horror films? Thanks.


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
I had a strange fondness for the bruised banana away kit. I certainly feel that the simple cannon was a design classic, with or without the cannon balls circa 1979.What about the art deco afc crest.


Mee
April 05, 2005
Rather than the new Arsenal Crest - why don’t they bring back the gun, just plain and simple, white on a red ground. I think spurs have corrupted their cockerel much less than we have the gun. Brazil 70 - you must wonder why those huge guns adorn the stands at highbury - its part of our histo , , , , , , never mind.


Long Time Gooner
April 05, 2005
Mee. Probably - feels about right and would fit with immediately after winning the title. I've been trying to remove that game from my memory.


Mee
April 05, 2005
LTGooner: Wasn‘t that the kit that was worn away to Wrexham in the cup - not one of my favourites.


Long Time Gooner
April 05, 2005
Least favourite away kit ever was that yellow and blue explosion in a paint factory job that we came out with in early 90's, just after a title win I think. It had some design like letter A's all over it. Mind you I do agree that the green/blue one was pretty grim. It will soon be hard to remember them all since new ones come out as often as limited edition postage stamps.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Not debating the rules Rob K just telling Niall what they are. Quite a difference. See, given I was a serial transgressor who indulged in debate with Steve on the very point during my "suspensions" it is unlikely you or Niall have anything close to my knowledge of "de rules". And Steve was much more even than you seem to think. "De rules" were very clear, very limited and very evenly applied. Talk of "off topic" forums etc is plain wrong and not in keeping with your limited, albeit commendable, role as guardian. And this is not something for individual debate by email. It is a fundamental forum issue. The very use of the word moderator is inconsistent with Steve's philosophy.


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
Mee, have to say I agree with you on this one.The trad red and white, yellow and blue plain and simple are best. however the shirt sales must raise some revenue for the club so we will just have to put up with it.I remember reading about how designers pick the colours of alt 2nd shirts to go with jeans and other leisure wear


Mee
April 05, 2005
Wirrall: I personally hated the last season away yellow shirts with that vivid blue collar and facings, particulary as worn by Ray Parlour who used to roll the waistband of his shorts over about three times. I can’t say I’m that fond of this seasons home kit shirts - as a general rule the less white on the body of the shirt the better -( look away now Nikola and Brazil 70 ) I prefer it when the shirts are true to the original before some 15 year old designer who has never been near a football match decides that all sorts of flashes and stripes are de rigeur.


Steve Martin
April 05, 2005
EEG, the vote thing was trying to be lightherted, remebering my poll a few years back... As for this site it does make me laugh, so keep up the good work, in truth, say what you like, I'll just have to live with it...


Wirral Gooner
April 05, 2005
Poor old Brazil 70. Getting a kicking from us oldies!! On the colour topic does anyone else think that in seasons when we dont have a yellow 2nd kit things never seem to go right? My brother and I wince every other year when they bring out a blue away kit. I still remember with horror the shiny blue and green unbro one from the early 80's.


Mee
April 05, 2005
Brazil 70: I take it your denial of the past also includes the wearing of our famous red shirts with white sleeves? Why don’t we just change colours every season Orange and heliotrope are reckoned to be strong this year.


Alex
April 05, 2005
8 years, and a lot of money, and not much to show for it. Bentley, Cole, Smith, and Hoyte. All are best young players were trained elsewhere. It is possible; Ajax, Parma, Cannes, Barcelona, Clairfontaine (yes, I know it's not a club). So what is the point of are Academy? How much longer until the quality really improves? Or is the problem with British youth? Or British football culture?


Long Time Gooner
April 05, 2005
Brazil70. Another thought In 15 years time will you have to have memories of Thierry surgically removed from your memory? Will you never mention him ever again? Will you never replay those exquisite moments again in your mind simply because they were in the past?


Long Time Gooner
April 05, 2005
Brazil70. I can't speak on behalf of the other oldies. However from my viewpoint I don't comment about the past in order to relive the good old days when 'I was in my prime'. It's simply reminiscing about times that usually weren't that good. It gives a sense of perspective to the fortunate times that we have experienced over the past few years. I suspect that some of our current fan base think that winning titles and having the bast player(s) in the world is the norm. Yes 71 and 89 were great but there was a lot that wasn't. Doesn't stop the love and the pain that goes with supporting Arsenal and the delight in sharing in the history.


Rob K
April 05, 2005
Guys - please don't debate the moderator rules w/ Niall. As Steve used to enjoy saying - its his forum and he can do what he likes. Whilst it isn't our forum, we hold it in trust for the big guy. Niall and I will try to moderate with Steve's light-handedness - but like Steve will show no patience for comments about the site moderation. If you do have to raise a moderator point by all means email one of us. Lets try to use our normal restraint to avoid the need for any moderation. PTBA-SG-G


Cannonn Balls
April 05, 2005
Niall,according to Souness only one player was involved in the handbags and that was Bowyer who head-butted the innocent Dyer threw a cluster of punches and then to make it look like Dyer was involved Bowyer then tore his own shirt from collar to waist,to reveal that even on a cold day on Tynside he does not wear a vest - who says Southerners are softies??. Now before you start having a pop about one fringe England player and one who had one game let me jog your selective memory about your Captain,who but for the grace of Old Mother Riley would have had another early bath last Saturday for an atrocious tackle.I refer of course to his infamous bust up with the then Republic Manager Mick McCarthy which led to Keano walking out on you at the last world cup and dashing back to Manchester to walk his dog and get condolences off his mentor the drunken jock. Mc Carthy though reveals why Keano might not have rated him has a manager,giving an insight into what his half time team talk consists of when things are not going too well. He says my magic words go something like this: "f***, b******s, b*****d, c**p, and p**s poor." Well it's obvious from that what was wrong, the team-talk was too intelligent for Keano to understand!.


Daz
April 05, 2005
Well, Puzzled, far be it from me to blow my own trumpet but I, the mighty Dazimus, father of a murdered child, owner of a giant ego invented it. Steve G didn't like swearing OR using the actual letters followed by asterisks as in Niall's appalling example to me yesterday or one of my drunken outbusts to chocolate which Niall rather unfairly reminded me of (frankly I think if you haven't been termporarily banned as both myself and EEG and I think KiwiPete have you can't really consider youself a forumite) . BUT anyway I digress, Mr Gleiber didn't mind a substitute and as EEG was the main user of the asterisk and a man as foul-mouthed as they come I used E*G as a replacement. Actually, I find using it now very - if not more - satisfactory. See, it's not so hard to find a modus vivendi (check me out, guys) if you really put your E*Ging mind to it.


Daz
April 05, 2005
The thing is, there's nothing wrong with people saying E*G me this is getting boring about ANY debate and, believe it or not, I notice that and it's only when chocolate is particularly E*Ging irksome or lies directly that I have to feed the horrible addiction that is engaging with him. What I really hate are the hypocrites who have a go at you and then get narked if you return fire, the stupid whinging about "show-offs" and "intellectual poseurs" and people who call for censorship or say that the forum HAS to be for one thing or that yes non-football topics should be tolerated but only the ones they approve of. Also people who are so thin-skinned that you wonder if they ever get of the house, bleating about insults. Yesterday, Niall called me a E*G (well actually he called me a but I hate to break forum rules). Do I give a E*Ging E*G? It's so not a big deal and anyway now we're back on speaking terms and he's held his hands up, admitted Ireland are E*G and that I am the cleverest of all the clever, renamed his cat Oliver instead of the ludicrous Pires and conceded that I am indeed the Cesc Fabregas of the site - (you silver-tongued charmer JamesLT). Anyway, now that my brownnosing little buddy decaf has so brilliantly exposed chocolate for the charlatan that he is - blatantly cut and pasting his google results I shall simple reply Hegel.Net every time he annoys me so brace yourselves for a lot of Hegel.Nets.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Brazil 70 - "I like my team to win and play beautiful football (in that order)". Highly controversial. And what person involved in football either as a fan, player, manager at any level has a different "philosophy". Which person says "I like my team to win and play ****"? Its the "order" which is the cop out. You think Brazil 70 and Arsenal now represent your philosophy but they had more balls because it is the beautiful football that comes first. The winning came about through that football but it was a decision in which direction to go. Other people with the same priorities as you, the same philosophy, have produced horrible-looking teams because the winning comes first. It truly doesn't for me anymore. And I dont believe that is how it works for Wenger either. I believe he has a philosophy about how the game should be played and then works to combine that into a winning formula.


Puzzled
April 05, 2005
What the E*G is the whole E*G thing about? What do the letters stand for


Mee
April 05, 2005
Brazil 70: When exactly does the present turn into the past for you, is it 3 hours, 3 days, or 3 months? It seems odd to invoke the spirit of the 1970s Brazil team with your forum name, and yet have no interest in the players whose performances you obviously admire.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Daz/Niall - I certainly agree Niall is taking on a task that is both uneviable and commendable. And I apologise to you Niall if my post seemed a little strong but I was concerned about the tone of your post. You have even encouraged the loon that is my mate Harlow to have another stab at electoral organisation! Why limit your vote to the forum Steve? What about "positive or negative"?! As far as I see it there is no vote to be had. Steve Gleiber was very clear to me "no intervention apart from swearing and offensive posting". And offensiveness is not to be judged by the feelings of the recipient. People know what is generally offensive. That rule is very simple and is one of the foundations of the site. There is no-one qualified to make a judgement on when an argument is boring or has gone too far. And I am not certain expansion should be the primary aim either.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
And then you get loonies saying "what can he do" and "he did brilliantly" after one home cruise against Norwich who, I apologise Harlow, are only officially the second ****test top flight side in the last ten years. You seem to have this obsession with being right. The problem in what you say is that you dont me saying "who is it that knows about football and who just watches and criticises". A statement all the more ludicrous when based on a game like Saturday's. I have never suggested I know everything. I have a view on Gilberto that differs from yours. It is just ****ing annoying to have someone ignore any other factors and believe that the last six months and a win against Norwich proves everything they have been saying! Gilberto didn't play against Villa. The performance in that game kicked the living **** out of the one on Saturday. Who played the invisible shield then because on your analysis he deserves a ****ing medal.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
Fair enough Brazil70, but I still think it strange and ironic that you name yourself after a 35 year old team and don't want to talk about anything other than the present. Surely by choosing your name alone you're drawing attention to the very historical 'happenings' you're not interested in discussing...


Daz
April 05, 2005
OK well I'm back like Harlow and I'm gonna have to stick up for Niall a bit here. Although, yes, I called him Stalin and told him to go E*G himself he is doing something that I wouldn't and he is (and this is NOT meant to sound patronising) finding his feet at it. I don't really mind his idea but only if a debate goes on and on although I worry about how that will be decided. Actually, the Sophist and Zeitgesit type debates are quite a laugh at the beginning but even at the end what could compensate for Detective Decaf catching chocolate in the most blatant piece of googling. Hegel.Net eh, chocolate? No wonder it took you a while to come back. The words bang to rights spring to mind and you're quite right, decaf, it's basic student plagiarism - so easy to spot. Of course such debates can get tedious although I agree with Harrow that they tend to peter out so can't understand why people get so hysterical. And my main point is - what were the big complainers doing at the time? Why didn't they just kick off their own debates? Well I have a theory but better not deploy it. And I have to say that there are people on here like Romford and goonerguru who reserve the right to themselves to attack people for their 'crap' but get all hot under the collar if their own stuff is questioned. Why don't you just lighten the E*G up and stop acting like the forum quality control police. There's no lack of space, that's the whole point. And really I have to say that those that think that I'm so vain that I need the validation of this page for my mighty intellect are so barking up the wrong E*Ging tree. I come on here to have a laugh mostly and - much as I hate to spell it out over and over again for the E*Ging retard brigade - that is as much at my expense as anybody elses.Well OK everybody else except chocolate with whom - I hold my hands up - I'm obsessed in the way that the WW1 Tommy was obsessed with trench lice. I like you Harlow, I think you're often funny and you can laugh at yourself but do I really really need you or any other disembodied voice on here to think I'm clever - not really. So get over yourselves, your stupid conspiracies about intellectual posers, pack away your anoraks, and just relax a bit more. I wouldn't have said anything at all to you, Romford, but if you want to have a pop at me you'll get it back so get used to it and stop E*Ging whinging about other people. Otherwise you can have "Ooh great post, Harlow, the way you were so spot on about Gilberto" or "Oh look there's another strut on the new stadium, won't it be great when it's finished" and everybody will die of E*Ging boredom.


Brazil 70
April 05, 2005
Bernard-You make some points I find I do not want to argue with.You are right, Arsenal have a history & that must contribute to where we are today in in a number of ways.However,I feel of more relevance to this years performance are issues such as Vieira's,Lehmann's & Toure's form.How we perform next season will be dependent on who we buy & who we sell.What we win next season will be affected by who Chelsea ,Manu,Liverpool& Real Madrid etc. buy or sell & whether they get relatively weaker or stronger in relation to Arsenal.I like my team to win & play beautiful football (in that order).Drawing up lists of "old time " footballers does not personally interest me at all (it clearly does lots of others which I accept).My view is that was then & this is now & now is what matters. Exiled-Brazil 70 represented for me world cup winners who played beautiful football & who cemented my love of the game.Why I love Wengers Arsenal so much more than other (old) Arsenal teams, is that I feel the team is infused with the same spirit.However, I hope you note I never drone on about Pele's great dummy against Uruguay or how good jairzhino was & whether he was better than Henry.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
Harlow - I am not that swayed by other players (Henry talks a load of **** at times - "fox in the box" anyone), web-sites, phone-ins etc - and actually of course its only if they support your view that you rate them. At other times you just "**** 'em". So I am to listen to the phone ins now? But you were telling us not to listen to them when the same people were slagging Gilberto last season. It is all too easy to excuse our pony defending, our weak psychology, our goal-keeping uncertainty, our spooked mummies boy of a record buy and our distracted management by saying all our problems were caused by the omission of a player who even his very biggest defenders pre-injury didn't dream of suggesting to be the very pivot upon which stood the entire 2004 Arsenal success that in his absence they have recreated him as.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
You see Harlow - that is your problem. You worry too much about other players (Henry talks a load of **** at times - "fox in the box" anyone), web-sites, phone-ins etc - actually of course its only if they support your view that you rate them. At other times you just "**** 'em". So I am to listen to the phone ins now that all the babies out there have readjusted their view. But you were telling us not to listen to them when the same muppets were slagging Gilberto last season. What is it to be? Everyone looks for excuses. And of course it is easy to excuse our pony defending, our weak psychology, our ageing key players, our goal-keeping uncertainty, our spooked mummies boy of a record buy and our distracted management by saying all our problems were caused by the omission of a player who even his very biggest defenders pre-injury didn't dream of suggesting him to be the very pivot upon which stood the entire 2004 Arsenal success that in his absence they have recreated him as.


Juliano
April 05, 2005
Niall-Vieira was born in Senegal this is true, but he moved when he was 4 I think, and when I hear him speak he doesn't have any accent at all. As for Zidane, he is not algerian, he was born and bred in Marseille, I don't even think he can speak arabic. Them too learnt their trade at AS Cannes by the way, and it has to be said that Arsène Wenger had been member of the youth coaching staff at AS Cannes (though probably before Vieira and Zidane's time there) and that this club has brought up some of the most promising talents in France (Gaël Clichy amongst others, but also one who was tipped to a big future but quite didn't live up to the expectations though apparently having a decent career in Spain, Peter Luccin)


steve martin
April 05, 2005
Niall, bit like the English team, some of the come from Manchester...


steve martin
April 05, 2005
Bernard, taken on a goals to games ratio, Henry is the best ever in the premeirship, he can even discuss Philosophy and Zeitgists, tell us the best wines, knows who the best out of Silvinho/Cole and Edu/Gilberto and could give us the difinative answer as to whether Ireland actually won/lost in the world cup...


Juliano
April 05, 2005
That said, seing that the french manager recently played a right footed player who only uses his left foot to get on the coach, Queudrue might be considered in the future? (if only to prevent him from playing against France :))


Niall
April 05, 2005
Juliano, France being a prime example not "the" mate, I wasn't singling you guys out. However, wasn't Vieira from Senegal, Zidane from Algeria and others from French colonies? Not trying to offend, just pointing out that Ireland are not alone, although Quedrue does sound like its pushing it just a bit, unless he has an Irish granny?


Bernard
April 05, 2005
Today's Guardian list the number of goals and games played by those Arsenal players who have scored at least 100 for the club. The number of games per goal (which I calculated for them all, the Guardian didn't show that statistic) for Wright and Henry is almost identical. However, I've no doubt Henry would be miles ahead in terms of assists.


Juliano
April 05, 2005
Niall-France being the prime example? I don't think the french team has ever played a player with so little connection to the country as Queudrue would have to Ireland.


steve martin
April 05, 2005
Democracy in action, lets have a vote on weather the site should be for mainly football or not... Half the problem comes form those showing of their intelect by going on for too bloody long about it... You mention the word Philsophy and three months later they are still going on about it, not anything interesting I might add, No! just trying to prove that I'm more intellugent than you are. or you don't know what your taking about... Talk about needding to get out their and grab a life...


Niall
April 05, 2005
I'd take him cos he's better than O'Shea myself. Anyway, so what, we could sit all day and count numerous players not playing for the nation of their birth, France being a prome example.


Juliano
April 05, 2005
Is this story about Queudrue true? I can hardly see how he could be eligible to play for Ireland, he has always been french as far as I know, and he hasn't ever played in Ireland. Is he married to an irish woman?


Romford Gooner
April 05, 2005
For what it's worth I would be quite happy to see Quedrue play for Ireland as it goes a long way towards totally devaluing Internationals and hopefully towards a point where top players will no longer want to play in them.


steve martin
April 05, 2005
You people, when something is atrring you in the face, Gilberto, you just cannot admit your WRONG, read some of the other web sites, listen to the Arsenal fans on the radio, listen to Arsene Wenger, what they say about him, even TH14 today on SKY, but NO!!! if you EEG, you must be right, listen lads I'm EEG, I say Gilberto's crap, whenever we beat someone easliy, that are the dregs of the division, anything to deflect the fact that in reality my knowledge of tactics and basic football, could be written on the back of a first class stamp... Still as I said time will tell...


Jimthegooner
April 05, 2005
What do you guys want Gilberto to do? I know Norwich were crap but considering Gilberto hasn't played a first team game since October i thought he did brilliantly. Gilberto isn't blessed with the skill that Henry or Pires has, he can't score superb hat-tricks or play several defence splitting passes. His job is to break up play, get a foot or body infront of the ball, disrupt the oppositions ryhthm and then play it simple to a player that can deliver a great pass or score a graet goal. In my opinion he is very important to this Arsenal team and has recovered just in time in order to help Arsenal gain second spot and hopefully a FA cup winners medal. Although Edu has improved vastly over the last 2 years at least Gilberto hasn't pissed around and looked for a better deal in Valencia just because he got called up to the Brazilian national squad a few times! Give him a break.


steve martin
April 05, 2005
EEG, it's all about understanding someone... I said I did not miss GOING to football, I did not say I miss watching it or talking about it, Big Diff, does that help...


Niall
April 05, 2005
Wasn't as funny as two England internationals having a full scale barney on the pitch Cannon, surely, even for a man as easily amused as you!!


Bodies In The Box
April 05, 2005
Seems from reading some people's opinions, Gilberto has had his best season for Arsenal. Yet he has hardly played. Strange. He played a decent game on Saturday against the crappest team in the league, but I'm not gonna change my opinion that he is the ideal man to partner Vieira based purely on the fact that we have been conceding more goals without him. Ridiculous. I'll look more to the stupid keepers we have, the injuries and poor form of Sol, the constantly changing central defensive pairing and the poor form of Vieira as the main reasons for that. Most people agreed at the start of the season that Edu was the man that should be first choice in that position. I've not changed my mind on that, because neither player has played enough this season to prove me wrong. All this stuff about Gilberto suddenly being a brilliant player based on what has happened in his absence in utter drivel.


Cannon Balls
April 05, 2005
One of the more amusing things over the weekend apart from seeing that shot of Robbie Keane diappearing down the tunnel at Villa in a huff after learning he was 4th choice striker at Spuds; was the interview with Frank Queudrue after the Palace game. Frank a Frenchman who has played for the French B side at full-back says that he now wants to play for the Republic of Ireland !. Having done a quick check on his lap-top on his ancestory Frank discovered that he has a gaelic one back in the mists of time. Which makes him egligible for Kerr's team. To further boost his claim Frankie also points out that: "I have tried Guniness and i like it". Right that will get him a Green Shirt for sure!.


Harrow Gooner
April 05, 2005
East End Gooner - Well said re Niall's rather scary post over the weekend. That kind of autocratic nonsense from one of the forums moderators is an insult to its participants. While there have been several tedious topics discussed (Sophism being just one example), these "off the topic" discussions (in moderation) is what makes this site so special & any excess tends to be self policed anyway (like when Daz realised that the Sophist debate went on far too long). IMO, the new moderators (& thank you to them) should either follow the founder's philosophy when policing this board or quit & start there own forum with rules that they design. If it aint broke....


Phil
April 05, 2005
Daniel Cohn Bendit, a German European Parlamentarian in Strassbourg has decided to form an "Alliance against FranzBeckenbauer" in order to prevent him from becoming UEFA boss.Platini is the right man for Europe he claims, should the Kiaser win it will be all about the giant-sized multinationals and slush.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
By the way Daz - I watched Open Water last night and found it tense as **** but not that depressing. I enjoyed it. OK I am not saying it was a feel-good film but I like it when they cant get a Hollywood ending out of the story. I reckon they abused the poetic licence with the "cast-off the gear and go down with dignity" ending. It was a bit of a cop out since in all likelihood she probably did her very best but ended up being eaten all the same - maybe even by her husband if they really did last the twenty hours or so. In that time you would get very hungry. Good lesson in not ****ing with the sea - which is a general rule of mine since I nearly died in Sri Lanka. Not at the "hands" of a shark but as a result of the kind of currents that give it the Lee Bowyer on your ideas of your own strength and immortality. Kept me awake a bit last night thinking of being out there in the water. Enjoyed it though!


Exiled In Newcastle
April 05, 2005
Brazil70 - if the past has so little relevence why call yourself Brazil70 not Brazil05?


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
And finally - one for the "off topic" forum when its CREATOR has finished his work. What a great weekend in London. The weather makes it - and for me it is better at this time of year than the summer - it is such a relief from not so long ago. Had the back end of last week off and have had four days of being out and about. The new(ish) park in Mile End, London Zoo (vastly improved - "meet the monkeys" is a great exhibit though brings to mind the Peter Kay quote about the smaller the monkey the more it looks like it would kill you given a chance), the pub (outside with the kids running around), my mate's back garden. Blinding all round and only an hour of football in the entire weekend. And do you know what Harlow - I didn't miss it a bit. As of course neither did you. Which brings to mind just one thing - if that is the case, why are you so ****ing insistent that it is the only thing people talk about on here?


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
On the football - it is great to see the "I told you so" revisionists couldn't even wait a sensible time before jumping in with their Gilberto foolery. So he had a decent game in a walkover against the crappest top flight team for many years and of course it proves that Harlow is the man who knows the game?! Classic stuff and you are bang on fellas. On the basis of that performance I agree what a brilliant player he was all of last year. Silly me for watching him and doubting him. Everyone will know how much work it takes to make that invisible wall (invisible to everyone except Chocolate and Harlow of course) against Norwich. He certainly managed to make his head invisible when that Huckerby shot came near it!


Romford Gooner
April 05, 2005
I see the barcodes have fined Bowyer 6 weeks wages! I thought the max under PFA rules was 2 weeks?? Am I the only one who can see the nightmare scenario that is the Chavs winning the title against us on the 20th? Daz, I've read your latest rubbish and will go back to ignoring your stupid posts as I have done previously.


East End Gooner
April 05, 2005
****ing scary post from you Niall over the weekend. The one where you introduced YOUR ideas about an "off topic" forum for debates YOU dont consider appropriate for YOUR new toy. I discussed people's concerns about non-Arsenal posts etc with Steve on a number of occasions and YOUR ideas would be a complete and utter betrayal of what he and this forum stood for. I apologise if this seems a little harsh and I suppose it is possible that you are doing this with the best intentions but it certainly doesn't come across that way. There are reasons why this forum was the best around and chief among them was that Steve had a philosophy of no interference on anything but swearing (a bug bear of his). Neither you nor anyone else has any right to alter that philosophy in even the smallest way. I along with many others are grateful for you, Rob and Roger acting as the technicians in administering the forum. But remember that is all you are.


Juliano
April 04, 2005
Sorry if it will sound a bit arse-licking but as a fairly recent fan, I find the posts about the Arsenal of the 70s and 80s highly enjoyable. Being from another country, it's not easy to feel the club and it's history, and reading raw facts cannot be compared to reading the first hand experience of those who were there, who saw Brady, McDonald, Ian Ure and so on. So I beg the "Old Timers" (no offence meant) to keep up posting their stories, those who are not interested can just skip them.


Bernard
April 04, 2005
Chippys, he was on the right.


Chippys Chisler
April 04, 2005
Only saw highlights of Saturdays match, can I ask someone who was there if Freddy played on the right or left. On the highlights he seemed to spend more time left with Pires central. Even his goal came from a right wing cross to the back post.


Bernard
April 04, 2005
Brazil70, yes what happened in the 70s and 80s very much has an impact of the modern Arsenal. For a simple example, those decades affect the size of our current fan base, which effects the need to move stadiums, which influences Wenger's transfer budget, which determines the players we have (or don't have) on the pitch, which effects results. The history of the club I would imagine also had an impact on Wenger's decision to take the job in the first place, and that's massively relevant to the modern Arsenal. And I think the ability to learn from past errors is just as applicable to football as to any other walk of life. You may not find the past very interesting, and that's fair enough. But please don't claim it's not relelvant to the club's current fortunes.


Barry Martin
April 04, 2005
Cannot believe there has not been criticism of Lehmann's totally unprofessional performance v Norwich.I was already angry at Lauren for not getting across quickly enough and giving away a corner when he could so easily have just conceded a throw. We know how dangerous corners are for the oppsn. Then Lehmann gets all fidgety as a Norwich player stands in front of him,flaps at the corner and then worst of all comes off his line remonstrating with the ref (presumably over what he perceived as a foul)while the ball is still in play. He is then not in the right posn for Huckerby's shot. Unforgivable. I cannot wait for the summer to see the back of all 3 keepers. Good riddance.If Wenger cannot find a top class one abroad there are at least half a dozen in the PL who are better than the 3 we've got.


Harrow Gooner
April 04, 2005
I was at the Norwich game and IMO, apart from TH14 the best player on the pitch was our (now afro haired) Brazilian who almost managed to be everywhere at the same time. His touch was assured and he mopped up all the loose balls in midfield. We improved after Cesc replaced Flamini (who was very ineffective & looks ill suited to our playing style) but the fact that we totally dominated the game was almost all down to Gilberto winning posession and keeping things neat in midfield. I'm still not happy that we could not keep a clean sheet at home against the worst side in the Premiership. However, it was a great sunny day, great goals (inc Huckerby's corker for Norwich) & a lovely atmosphere - could have been 8 or 9 nil. A fantastic steak lunch in the Mezzanine Suite (with Frank Carson entertaining) before the game & meeting TH14 on his way out after the game topped off a great afternoon. NB - it was SOOOO obvious that TH14 & Reyes dont get on. He seems like a disruptive influence & cant go soon enough for me.


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Decaf,football is full of if's and why's Fabregas, Senderos were thrown in at the deep end and have responded extremelly well. Senderos showed in his games against Bayern Munich and last week for the Swiss against France his undoubted class,just a question mark hanging over his ability to stay fit,like Robben at Chelsea, otherwise i cannot see any logical reason why he should not progress. Fabregas will be even better next season and i would expect to see him play a large part in us retreiving our title from the imposters at the Bridge.Toures pooor heading is a weakness for a CB and our opponents know this and try to exploit it,his positional sense is not great either,he will need to improve on those skills if he wants to retain his position next season at CB.


Brazil 70
April 04, 2005
Bernard-I am not arguing that in some( very rare for football) instances lessons cannot be learned from the past or that posters cannot discuss their favourite teams from yesteryear,just that I personally find it boring,irrelevant & don't read it.Honestly, do you feel what happened in the 70's & 80's (even early 90's) has any relevance to what happened saturday or will happen to the team next week? Arsenal is now a team of largely foreign players managed by an urbane multilingul french economics graduate whose last team was in Japan & whose current biggest threat is a Portugese Psychology graduate backed by a multi billionaire Russian oligarch.Who could have forseen that in the 80's.IMO People talk about the past (10 years or more) because they are getting older & like to relive the "good old days" (when they were young & in their prime possibly) which is fair enough,not because it tells us anything about what will happen today or tomorrow in the modern game.That's my view which I suspect is a minority view. But I repeat, I am not attacking anybody's right to wander down memory lane.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
And if Gilberto and Edu had been fit all season would Fab have got a look in? And with a fit Vieira and Gilberto next season?


Decaf
April 04, 2005
With the exception of Cygan (if only "the exception of Cygan" from our team became permanent), most of what you say, Cannon, is based on one season or even one game's worth of analysis. Kolo should be given another chance, because he is a monster and (I think) has the defender's instinct. Someone pointed out his farcical heading technique, but couldn't he work through that? Similarly, Vieira has only had one bad season (last season he was OK if not as dominant as he has been) and may turn it around. Cesc may look good, but it is simply too early to tell, and the same goes for Senderos. Campbell I am sure will be back to his best next season. Gilberto? Absence makes the heart grow fonder soon to be replaced with familiarity breeds contempt?


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Decaf,i must confess, and i only watched a recording of Saturdays match against a poor Norwich who look lower league material, but we seemed not to miss Vieria. With Gilberto playing, who also seems to gel better with Fabregas - by not unlike Viria trying to be the playmaker - but sticking to his holding role in front of the defense -and boy did they need him - just that ducking out of the way of Huckerbys - the poor mans Damien Duff - to blot his copybook, on what was a very encouraging reappearance - albeit against modest opposition. However defense wise already Senderos looks to be a massive influence and was missed. Sol came back from Euro 04 injured and missed pre-season and in truth looked like a shadow of last seasons player. We need to see if after his recovery and return to full fitness how it pans out for him. Toure though very mobile does not really cut the mustard for me at top level, but those are problems for AW to ponder upon and with money to burn he will i would expect address them if he believes it nescessary to do so. Cygans got to go - he looks slower than RVN and that is seriously slow! - he did little wrong on Saturday but his lack of co-ordination with Lehmann who is another one that is unconvincing is apparent - and players due to the bald-headed ones slowness are always having to watch out for him knowing that he is an accident waiting to happen. I see that Owen scored his 13th goal of the season for RM last night in one of his few starts, he could replace the Horsefaced nerd at OT in the summer. I am still not convinced either about Reyes and would like to see RVP get more action in the remaining games this season. I reckon like most that we will see a few comings and goings in the close season and maybe a surprise or two.


Mee
April 04, 2005
Perhaps we should ask ourselves the question of why CG feels he has to resort to googling websites in order to give his utterances some sort of validity. Perhaps he is blinded by the intellectual glare from Daz and Decaf (among others).


steve martin
April 04, 2005
Exiled I could not agree more, Freddie Shepherd should tell them they are not wnated at the ground... I'm sure it's only for publicity... They should be out on the streets getting the real criminals, but hen that's to hard for them... The Law in this country is, simply put, pathetic...


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Relevant of course or irrelevant it all seems much ado about nothing.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Cannon, what makes you think all of us have laid down our arms? We colonials are made of sterner stuff than you soft stay at home go-off-in-a-huff types. *** If we rule out the unthinkable (Henry being tempted away or getting sick of it), the big footballing question for me is out spine. Can Vieira and Campbell get back to where they were? Another season with effectively half a Sol and half a Paddy will b another season of frustration, especially with Paddy as club captain.


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
The only relevent question is,who really cares anyway?.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Daz, your quite correct CGs utterances are like one of those student essay that has suspiciously lucid bits between the much. I couldn't be bothered to go through all of Choc's "suspiciously lucid bits", but got this from Hegel.net (http://www.hegel.net/en/spirit.htm). “'Geist' is a German word which has all the meanings of the English words: spirit, mind, soul and the French word, esprit. German language makes no distinction between spirit and mind: for both, Germans use the same word, 'Geist'. While 'Geist' is usually translated either as spirit or mind (e.g. Philosophy of Spirit, Phenomenology of Mind), the English reader is perhaps well-advised to think of 'Geist' as both together, e.g. Spirit/Mind.” Choccy wrote: “'Geist' is a German word which has all the meanings of the English words: spirit, mind, soul and the French word, esprit. German language makes no distinction between spirit and mind: for both, Germans use the same word, 'Geist'. While 'Geist' is usually translated either as spirit or mind the English reader is perhaps well-advised to think of 'Geist' as both together, e.g. Spirit/Mind”. Hegel.net shamelessly plagarising AND falsifies the date to make it seem like they got there first?


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Gut tag!. It seems rather like the day after the Lord Mayors Ball on here today!. There was more abuse flying about yesterday than in a debate on Fox-Hunting in the House of Lords. Wenger urging the board to put AC3 on to the same wage parity to the other top earners at the club around £75000 a week seems to be a sensible idea. The original offer of £45000 a week seems in view of Coles improvement and world class rating to have been well short of the amount of money that he would be earning elsewhwere. Chelsea were prepared to pay him £90000 - Wenger points out that we cannot match that figure but is hopeful that AC will stay at the club. Cole could of course do a Sol and see out his contract and leave on a Bosman - that would coincide with our moving to the new stadium - so perhaps the lure of that and Wengers persuasion - plus the what must have been the highly unpleasant, and nauseating experience of having met Kenyon and Moaninho face to face will deter him from leaving and prompt AC instead to sign a new improved contract at Londons biggest and most famous club - rather than move to a smaller one that is temporarily flush with someone elses money???.


Niall
April 04, 2005
Well Exiled, at least you weren't brutally attacked by a member of the local constabulary and thrown to the ground in an attack that can only be described as vicious when I was and am an innocent man. At a mate's house for a party when we were 19-21, things were getting a little out of hand and the pealers were called in (all the best parties had to have a visit from Special Branch). As they entered my mates house without the express permission of the owner, I stood up, all 5'9 skinny rake of me to the 6 foot 4 burly cop and told the cop he had no right entering the house. He also had no right to grab me in an armlock, drag me to the garden and basically humiliaite me either but it didn't stop the fat git. Even since then I've been psycologically damaged and had an aversion to big burly cops who eat too many doughnuts. Can I still sue?


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
I take that back. I can give one example of (to my mind) superb Police work. Now it's certainly not something I'm proud of but someone tried to mug me a couple of years back and I kind of flipped. Broke his leg and arm and a few ribs before someone pulled me off. He had over 100 convictions for mugging and the like but he tried to get me prosecuted for assault (of which, right or wrong, I was obviously guilty). This situation worried me for a while until the Sgt that had been dealing with the case turned up at my door and asked to come in. I thought I was about to be nicked but he was there to tell me that they'd 'persuaded' the guy to drop his charges, if I didn't follow up the original mugging.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
Parkerknoll - from personal experience it wasn't the CPS. With Jr the old bill said they could get the kids prosecuted but it wasn't worth them doing the paperwork. With my car the CPS were willing to proceed but it was the Police that declined. The obvious inferance is that he grassed someone to be let off, but the Police have the ability in these cases to pay insurance costs but they refused point blank. Not to mention the letter we received in December telling us that Jr had been talked to by an officer at a park in town. The letter stresses he did absolutely nothing wrong but was 'in the area'. Now apart from the ignorance of them not being able to spell his first name (which is a completely normal English name) and even calling him something completely different later in the letter, Jr was actually in hospital at the time and there's absolutely no way he could have been there. Not to mention a letter dated 12 Dec referred to an incident on 11 Sept. And this is the same Police force that has officers able to give people tickets for ood tax at 3 minutes past midnight. I'm not anti-Police, but I've NEVER had an acceptable experience.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Exiled, these petty criminals are as irritating, persistent, and seemingly irredeemable as Chocolate gooner, and in the final analysis there is nothing to be done about either. So if you aren't having fun chasing them down (and it stopped being fun some time ago) one might as well do something else of a Sunday.


Mee
April 04, 2005
Exiled: I had my car broken into in a remote country area and briefcase stolen along with cheque books, cards etc. An onlooker gave the id of the thief (teenage boy) to police. The police said that he was well known to them but because his solicitor always cited a child abuse background (real or imagined?) they could not proceed further. If I then visited the boy and removed my own belongings I would be prosecuted myself!


Mr Q
April 04, 2005
Exiled, didnt it occur to the dozy s*ds that he may have got changed before they caught him?


Lemon and Lyman
April 04, 2005
(Written on behalf of Daz who is sitting sobbing with his ball at the end of the garden) Thanks for those words, GaryB, it's really not supposed to be taken too seriously. But you know what they say about never missing your water and it's not good to spend too much time listening to the voices of the "invisible people".That's "invisible people" like Romford Gooner, for example, toasted the cyber-world over for his erudite and incisive Arsenal-related posts. If a PhD in common sense-type like Romford says it's crap then it's crap and we should move on to Gilberto. I should, however, clear up the misconception that Daz doesn't post about Arsenal. Frequently, I do...sorry...frequently he does as you will see if you refer to his postings on Cole/Martin Hayes/the problem with our defence/Wenger after Man U/Edu versus Gilberto, but being the all-round renaissance man that he is he sometimes also finds the time to digress - on a sunny afternoon when nobody is talking about E*G all else onto I-Pods or the meaning of zeitgeist In fact, somebody started a post with "not much more to say about yesterday" although I doubt whether that's going to stop people from saying it again. But no more Daz/chocolate, it's time for the main act (drum roll) Rooooomford Goooooooneeer, ladies and gentlemen and an update on Super-Bob's cruciate ligament worries....


Oliver's Army
April 04, 2005
Watch Niall you tosser, we're coming back for you.


Parkerknoll Gooner
April 04, 2005
Exiled - perhaps you should direct your anger towards the CPS and those that sit in judgement as well as those that control the purse strings. How would you feel as 1 of 3 responsible for policing a population of 85,000 on a weekday evening, if the wider public knew what a mess the Force was in at the moment they'd never sleep at night.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
You couldn't make it up and I'm absolutely livid. Northumbria Police have issued a statement that they are going to send a delegation to Newcastle United to discuss what happened Saturday. They also say they've received NO complaints from the public. No wonder they don't solve crimes! 2 Examples. 1. Jr was mugged for his mobile by a gang. Id'd the culprits from mug shots and the police said it wasn;t worth proceeding. 2. I'm asleep and my car's parked. Police chase and catch a drunk in a stolen car (with a long record) but not before he crashes into my car. Despite a Superintendant being in the chasing car and id'ing the driver they refused to prosecute because, despite him being seen driving the car, despite his fingerprints being all over the car, despite them seeing him running from the car, they did fibre lifts on the seats which didn't match his clothes. What's the point of them?


steve martin
April 04, 2005
Gilberto has some drawbacks in his passing, but overall, the job he does is crucial to the team, we're better with him than without him... Chelsea have had an extrodinary season, funny how it's coincides with 200m being spent...Exiled, not in my league yet, you have to stay away for at least a day...


Bernard
April 04, 2005
Brazil70, I think you have to realise that in any walk of life the past shapes the future. In terms of health service administration, what is currently happening in the Labour Government's NHS is to a very significant degree a direct result of the service's internal market introduced by the Thatcher Government. Similarly, what is happening at Arsenal now is to a large extent dependent on what happened to the club in the past, just as what happens to Arsenal in the future will be driven by its current position, and its past. That's not to say everything in the past will affect the future, but some of it most certainly will. Hence the idea of ignoring the past if you're only interested in the present or future is therefore a nonsense, in my view.


steve martin
April 04, 2005
Will TH14 get in the top three this season of the Players of the year award... The last two season he has won it, this season is has not left off from where he finished, still scoring bundles, still assisting in loads of goals, still playing great football that fans love to watch... Based on it's the Player of the year award and not the club, will he get in the top three...


DHD
April 04, 2005
Nothing much to add to what's been said about Saturday. A bit of a stroll and a good weekend all round really. Nice to see Gilberto back though. I never thought I'd say this but there's somthing to this 'invisible shield' thing. He really added something with his knack of spotting threats and his amazing speed to close down or clear. He made a big difference to our defence who really had an armchair day. And he was needed because patently the Jens/Pascal/Kolo thing just does not work; it was just as well it was only Norwich. I thought JAR also did pretty well but he got the benefit of a full TH14 strop when he failed to pass to the great man early on. He got another earful from FL8 shortly after. I get the sense that JAR is about as welcome in the THOF dressing room as a fart in a specesuit. BTW, I checked the programme for a mention of Steve G, but I couldn't find anything. Did I miss it?


Decaf
April 04, 2005
James LT. You don't like me. I can live with that. Thanks for the kind words. Niall, as far as I remember, Steve ran this forum with a light hand and a sense of humour. Ring any bells? Let me sum up the two general strands of the 'orthodox' discussion on this forum. a) Gilberto after one average game is suddenly better than sliced bread, QED. b) Orthodox forum members and the police don't like discussion about philosophy or the rules of logic (or I presume, statistical inference, although we haven't yet had Chocolate's and James' views on why all the textbooks and dictionaries are wrong in that particular subject). Carry on!


JP
April 04, 2005
Adam, so far behind? Yes but lets admit Chelsea have had an extraordinary season. the pts tally we have would ordinarily put us in with a 99% chance of winning it


JP
April 04, 2005
Looks like we will need to take pts off Chelsea on Apr 20th or else hope Utd take at least 4pts from their next two matches if we are to stop the blues winning the title vs us. Thats assuming they beat Birmingham next of course!


Adam Pembrey
April 04, 2005
It is strange I suppose, but then who would have thought we would be so far behind? Who would have thought that we would have conceded so many goals? This summer there will be lots of speculation about team line ups and results for next season, but it is guaranteed that things will happen that no one can or will predict.


Mee
April 04, 2005
With Liverpool looking likely to overtake Everton and secure 4th place, I have a feeling that Gerrard might stay. ‘At the merment’ (Lawrenson) he is their talisman, given positional freedom to respond to the demands of the game as he sees fit, it’s an enthusiastic, all-action, high-tempo, aggressive approach. However, when he finds himself in more celebrated company, his plays a less expansive game and his performance suffers. His recent England appearances bear this out and it was particularly noticeable, albeit in a friendly, when he played in the Tsunarmi appeal match rubbing shoulders with established star players. He must be aware of this himself and I would imagine he would rather stay a big fish in small liverpool. I mention this because it might upset Chelsea’s plans to take over the world and consequently might allow us to mount a closer challenge to them next term.


Romford Gooner
April 04, 2005
Who would have thought at the start of the season that Gilberto would be greeted in April like the long lost prodigal son and that Reyes and Cole are seen by some as looking for transfers at the end of the season. I still think Gilberto isn't as great as some make out, his passing is even worse then Paddy's though he is does break up a lot of attacks. Some things haven't changed though, Daz still posts a load of crap on every topic under the sun.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
Hey I'm back. Bet you're all glad. OK, truth is I did it myself because it just occured to me that in all the time I've been here I've never stormed off in a huff and immediately come back and I just wanted to have a go. I realise that I can never reach Harlow's standard, but, hey, I can tell the grandchildren in years to come...


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
Niall - I take it all back. I post and my name doesn't come up!!! What's this - censorship? Come on mate that's just not fair really. I come on here and just want to have a chat and all of a sudden my name's not welcome!! Well sod the lot of you I'm leaving and not coming back.



April 04, 2005
OMOH - cheers mate - keep 'em coming. As for the Mermaid Avenue albums I've actually got that volume in my car and that particular song (along with 'Last night, or the night before last') is a favourite. I'm sure Woody would be quite amused at an old punk and his 16yo grunge kid driving along singing along to Essex boy's interpretation. Pete Seeger and Almanac Singers are also popular here. Quite sadly I first became aware of Woody through his son Arlo's film of Alice's Restaurant. I'm so glad I did watch that film and become interested because Woody Guthrie has become both an icon and anti-icon. Amazing life, and he really chronicled the un-chronicled side of the age (I don't dare make the sentence shorter by using any namby pamby foreign words). Now, football. Gilberto. Not being able to get to many games right now I wasn't there yesterday so don't want to comment on highlights but I'm delighted to have him back and also delighted by Henry's comments about him. The job the likes of Gilberto and Makelele do is the most important in football bar none because it's the pivot. It's also the least glorified (and dare I say understood) as well. Personally I think it's a job that was really 'invented' by the 'W' formation and what was called a centre half then is now a central midfielder. But whatever the formation the job is the same really. The loose guy who fills the gaps. Talking of Henry there was a great bit in his interview for MotD. Titi was holding the match ball and the interviewer said 'I suppose there's no point asking you for that'. Titi grinned and said 'Well I would give it to you but it's only a football and I know you don't really want it' with that lovely sweet grin on his face that makes you want to introduce him to your daughter! DAz and Niall - can I be a godparent? As A serious point in a long ramble I think we should all thank Niall for taking on one hell of a lot of work to keep this place (in whatever form) going. I might not agree with some things but fair play mate (although Spain beat them green boys). And I'm sure he'd appreciate any (real) offers of help taking this place forward.


GaryB
April 04, 2005
O.K. Now I'm worried. About myself. When I first started reading the forum I found Daz to be mildy entertaining. Over time, this turned to irritation. However, now its turned to fascination. I find myself scrolling past the football debates to find the latest piece of cutting insult and wit by, or aimed at, Daz. Generally football is a tiny percentage of the content of these posts so the drama content is high. I've never liked Soaps (except the excellent American comedy called Soap), but find the one currently running on here very compelling. So now I'm worried about myself and feel the need to seek help. Worse still, I find myself reluctantly supporting Daz's existance as part of the general 'richness' of the forum's culture. I would hate to see him (her?) hounded out.


Niall
April 04, 2005
Yes, I am pleased to report that after exchanging a few of these modern techology things called emails, Daz has finally admitted that the Irish side were eliminated from the 2002 World Cup undefeated, having lost the tie and not the match on penalties. He has also admitted that Cromwell was a big tart and murdering oaf and that Ashley Cole was never better than Silvinho at the time. He has also recognised his error in that Edu will never meet the level of Emmanuele (steady on) Petit, but more importantly he has agreed with my great idea (Daz's words) that if long drawn out repetitive debates not surrounding Arsenal occur - to put them into an off topic thread where all the protagonists can hammer away to their hearts content is rather sensible and fair. And who said the Irish and English could never agree, though he knows it was the threat of the reawakened Torqemada that put the fear of, dare I say it, God into him.


Daz
April 04, 2005
Good news. Niall has just e-mailed to apologise for his slurs and also for breaking forum rules by using asterisks with the actual letters rather than the E*G which - modesty doesn't forbid me from saying - I invented. He's said that I'm the cleverest person on the forum and that nobody is half as clever as me and that I should talk about whatever I want and that if he had half my intellectual prowess he'd be a snob as well (obviously I'm paraphrasing) That's good enough for me and in that spirit I'd like to thank Niall in his diffcult task of running the forum and retract my own invitation for him to go E*G himself and I won't now remind him of his own run-ins with authority because as I remember the little BMurph parodies weren't about football but it would be churlish to point that out now that we've kissed (well he's kissed my arse) and made up. And before I go (I'm making this my last day rather than my last post) it only remains to say: chocolate you're a E*G.


Cannonn Balls
April 04, 2005
OMOH,is there any chance of waving a towel of GunGun and making him vamoooosh!!!!!!!!!!!!


old man of hoy
April 04, 2005
For ExiledAn older Jewish gentleman marries a younger lady and they are very much in love. However, no matter what the husband does sexually, the woman never achieves orgasm. Since a Jewish wife is entitled to sexual pleasure, they decide to ask the rabbi. The rabbi listens to their story, strokes his beard, and makes the following suggestion. "Hire a strapping young man. While the two of you are making love, have the young man wave a towel over you. That will help the wife fantasize and should bring on an orgasm." They go home and follow the rabbi's advice. They hire a handsome young man and he waves a towel over them as they make love. But it doesn't help and she is still unsatisfied. Perplexed, they go back to the rabbi. "Okay", says the rabbi, "let's try it reversed. Have the young man make love to your wife and you wave the towel over them." Once again, they follow the rabbi's advice. The young man gets into bed with the wife and the husband waves the towel. The young man gets to work with great enthusiasm and the wife soon has an enormous, room-shaking screaming orgasm. The husband smiles, looks at the young man and says to him triumphantly, "You see, THAT'S the way to wave a towel!


Bored
April 04, 2005
HENRY 4 NORWICH 1. I never thought I'd be pleasantly surprised to see our invisible Brazilian back but I was. Not that he was amazing or anything but he had a solid game. Good job we were playing Norwich because anyone else would surely have punished that shaky defence. Here's a song from some wag in the East Upper; "Jo-se-an-to-ni-oo.....he's going to go-o-oooo". I think it will be a shame if non Arsenal topics are banned. More often than not I think it adds something to the forum but when its tedious, just scroll past it.


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Mee,if you had no idea of what the Philosophical debate was about then then why did you hope that the football discusions would follow suite?. The so called 'Sophists debate'was boring.


old man of hoy
April 04, 2005
Loren and Bergman - what a midfield partnership, eh? The great Woody Guthrie penned the following lines and Billy Bragg supplied the music. Ingrid Bergman, Ingrid Bergman,let's go make a pictureOn the island of Stromboli, Ingrid BergmanIngrid Bergman, you're so perty,you'd make any mountain quiverYou'd make fire fly from the crater,Ingrid BergmanThis old mountain it's been waitingAll its life for you to work itFor your hand to touch its hardrock,Ingrid Bergman, Ingrid BergmanIf you'll walk across my camera,I will flash the world your story,I will pay you more than money, Ingrid BergmanNot by pennies dimes nor quarters,but with happy sons and daughters,And they'll sing around Stromboli,Ingrid BergmanAnd i wouldn't say no to a bit of Totti at Highbury next season.


GunGun
April 04, 2005
American Gooner....I know what you mean. Please excuse some of the forum`s more bitter and aggressive members. I for one, am pleased to read you views and can sincerely say that for somebody living so far away from the centre of footballing activity, you are very well informed about football and Arsenal. Actually, I always thought you were an exiled Brit living in the States. Anyone on this forum who picks on you for being American should be ashamed of themselves. Please stay on, American Gooner, You are more than welcome.


Brazil 70
April 04, 2005
American Can I clarify what I said about the discussions of old football.I said it bored me personally but it was legitimate for a supporters forum & I accepted that I would not find every subject of football related debate interesting .Consequently I did not read those posts & found something else to do.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
OMOH - Bergman everytime. (and I'd like to point out that she also played left half for a few seasons so this is a football discussion...) Oh go on mate, tell us a joke.


Mee
April 04, 2005
Cannon Balls: Let me qualify my last post. What I am saying is that because the Sophists debate was ongoing at the time I firsrt looked at the site, I imagined that the level of football debate would be of a similar quality. I didn‘t understand a word of that philosophical argument.


old man of hoy
April 04, 2005
Can't say i understand how the forum is in any way diminished by contributors reflecting on Arsenal's history, our past players or our own memories and experiences as fans. Surely we are in a better position to comment upon what has been rather that than what may happen in the future? Philosophers please don't feel obliged to answer that one in detail! What we do know is Gilberto has returned and that is so good. The previously fickle fans have warmed to him because absence has made our hearts grow fonder. He is also admired because he has shown a lot of "bottle" in hopefully overcoming a serious injury. Yesterday he played with economy and skill and he had a suprise for us - he has grown his hair. The crowd even forgave him a pass that was misplaced by about 40 yards. Turning to the months ahead i see Real lost 1-0 to second from bottom Albacete so there will be plenty of transfer activity down old Madrid way. Mourinho could be on his way taking Ashley Cole with him. American, the Cole song is a rather mundane dirge copy of one that United fans used for Andrew Cole. Mind you in his relatively unloved state it probably sounded as good as Beethoven's Ninth to the friendless Ashley. Sophia Loren or Ingrid Bergman?


Daz
April 04, 2005
You total E*Ging hypocrite, Niall. Go E*G yourself.


Daz
April 04, 2005
The temptation to attend your own funeral is enormous as Harlow knows only too well. Patrick, you are a great big girl, mate. Why can't people be nice to each other? It is - as Stalin..oops sorry Niall says - a E*Ging football forum. Where do you discuss yours? And I can assure you my life is ticking over quite nicely so the idea that I'd feel the need to seek some kind of validation from you is quite ridiculous. Utterly pathetic and sissy reactions - one last question (maybe) IS ANYBODY E*Gng STOPPING YOU FROM POSTING WHAT THE E*G YOU WANT???


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Mee, why is it that i am not surprised to discover that the - 'Sophisticated debate'(sic) attracted you to the site???.


Niall
April 04, 2005
Daz, thanks for your pathetic email, JamesLT thanks for your much more constructive one. A few points. Daz, remove me from your buddies list all you please. I've never met you, and am unlikely to, especially now!! Secondly, when you were riding to my rescue when I bored the forum rigid (at least it was about football) we'll not forget the time Steve felt he had to ban you from the forum for doing exactly as you are now. Being an arrogant, self seving childish. I thought you had quit posting? For about the fifth time? Anyway, over the past few days I've read you give abuse to me, Goonerguru, Harlow, American etc etc, just so you can carry on your pathetic little diatribe with Chocolate (which lets face it, is your main concern, not the forum). Now that I've responded to Daz's personal abuse to me, all I'm trying to do is move the forum forward while trying to keep its appeal to those who are already here. I have suggested an off topic forum where you can have the debates with others while keeping the Arsenal only people happy, which is what the site was set up for. For example, sophistry and the latest look like they could go on ad nauseum again so they couldbe tapered off to another forum where you can read and participate if you want. Personally, I haven't got anything against the non football topics but when it comes down to the same few people indulging in intellectual snobbery on a constant basis, then yeah Exiled, I think I'd prefer the kids. I'm trying to be fair to everyone here.


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
or 5 pages of 'Reyes only plays well in the sunshine' with such inciteful posts as "I have realised the Reyes plays really well in the bright sunshine. I think that Andalusia, the part of Spain that he is from is really sunny." Niall - you'll be begging for people talking about Sophie (or whatever) before long mate.


Mee
April 04, 2005
Exiled - you took the line out right of my keypad about Brazil 70!


Exiled In Newcastle
April 04, 2005
So no more non football talk...get ready for the 4 o'c stampede of school kids with threads about how gorgeous Thierry is. And (not having a pop but) I do think it's ironic that someone called Brazil70 says don't talk about the past.


Mee
April 04, 2005
Resisted entering the debate but must now do so. The non-football posts from Daz, Decaf and Chocolate are part of what makes this site so attractive. I see it as good natured posturing between well informed individuals. If Chocolate didn’t exist, Daz and Decaf would have invented him. If you don‘t want to read their posts, scroll past them. Thankfully when they comment on football matters their posts retain the intellectual rigor of their philosophical debate. I will go as far as to say that the original sophistry debate is what first attractd me to the site.


Daz
April 04, 2005
Ah you retrieved that one brilliantly, James LT. I like the idea of being Fabregas. I can assure you in my own arch and arrogant way that I really didn't come on here to prove I'm clever to a bunch of people of whom a third seem kind of funny and normal, a third are dull-asE*G suburban anoraks and a third are barking at the moon. And then, of course, there's chocolate gooner. I come on because I'm bored and I work weekends and it's kind of a change of gear and most of the time I'm taking the piss out of myself (something which some people clearly struggle with). Anyway I'm not cheating an employer but my own deadlines so actually that's quite a good wake up call. Anyway, you're in the terrifying hands now of that turncoat ingrate Niall who's forgotten his own battles with authority and the countless times I rode to his own defence when he was boring the forum utterly E*Gless. It;'s a football forum, Niall, you big gobE*G (I won't add 'Fenian' as you might construe that literally as well and accuse me of xenophobia). And of course chocolate who will only post about football from now on (YEAH RIGHT!!!) Hasta nunca!


Patrick
April 04, 2005
American, i wouldn't worry about it. i suppose on internet forums people generally make less effort to get along and be nice to each other as there is no personal contact. I rarely post here but check the site a lot and think its quite pathetic that certain posters go to such lengths to try and impress people with their intellect over the internet. probably due to an inability to impress people in real life.***** Anyway back to football. ashleys song that im familiar with goes ashley cole, ashley ashley ashley cole repeated over and over again. not sure what the tune is. i would't read too much into gilberto returning and us winning 4-1 as it was only norwich but a good performance nevertheless. i think with the right signings next season we should be right back in contention for the title. i really want reyes to stay because like others have already said i can see him becoming one of the best players in the world. i think the club has to make every effort to try and help him settle and that might include arsene telling thierry to get off his back a bit. looking forward to next season already.


SOLMAN
April 04, 2005
When Reyes joined the club I was exited like most fans , on close inspection he looked the real deal , great skills , good looking boy with a great happy personality , i predicted he would be better then Henry BUT now I want him to leave , WHY , on close inspection yes he is quick but not super quick , yes he has got great close control but its erratic ar times , yes he can run with the ball but sometimes overruns it , he does not appear to have a great football brain hence he is on a different wavelength from Henry and co , where are the great goals ??? , for 17 mil I would expect more sorry but he should be sold not because he wants to gos back to Spain but because he is not good enough . Maybe this is harsh but count the games when he has been anything but a marginal figure , when has he taken responsibility and won games for us ??


AmericanGooner
April 04, 2005
Brazil 70, with the exception of the old stories ;- ) (you can't hear stories of the old days like that anywhere on the net, only at a pub) , I agree with the rest. The breadth of knowledge is what I like about this forum above all others. That is what I wrote to Steve about when we submitted emails for the book. Believe it or not, I'm thought of as someone who is knowledgeable about footie matters on one or two other forums I go to, which tells you how lacking some forums are in analysis and critical arguments about the game and about Arsenal. However, you are right about some. I appreciate criticism when its specific. Bernard, Exiled, to name a few, have at least been specific about something I have written that didn't seem true or been mistaken about (were we boring during the '91 season, etc.). Fair play to borrow a phrase, to responses like that, I take no ill will, I've done the same. Some though, will state a generality "American you know nothing about football' but no specifics when I ask for it, which I can only assume then its a dislike for either my style of writing (admittedly boring or lacking the English wit) or perhaps my nationality or perceived politics or their politics manifesting itself. Without specifics I can only assume its personal. I don't mind any disagreements about what I write footie related and welcome the analsys. I can learn something new or solidify my opinion as being correct depending on the response. Americans have a certain fondness for all things English, above any other people on the planet. I guess its part of the 'special relationship' we have always heard here. Growing up, I was no different. I also never try to generalize a nation or people. I take people individually as I meet them, especially after doing a big of traveling throughout my life, but I must say I have a very different view since being on a couple forums, this being one of them. I've disagreed with many at the Brit pub here on various football matters, gooners and non gooners alike. But its rarely personal, we are quick to buy each other a pint and the other person is usually the one that asks for my phone number to hang out outside the pub. I'm told I'm affable (or laughable footie wise--hehe) and an oddity to most being a footie obsessed yank. However, I see a vast contrast between the Brits, Aussies, Irish and the like I meet at the pub and the ones I see posting on here. Are the ones at the pub fake and are really like some of you guys on here? Or because they wished to come here they are the more affable and left the surly ones back at home? I've often wondered and have even asked one or two. I don't care if I'm liked or not, its not what I'm saying, there are a few posters who I don't like personally and have no desire to ever meet, but will agree with them if they are right. Some may feel the same about me perhaps. The vitriolic slagging is scary at times. It takes a brave soul to agree with any footie related posts of the 'unpopular kids' on the forum. Its like in grade school where you didn't want to be seen in the company of the kid everyone picked on. Compounded by the fact that we're all gooners. Its something I'll have to get used to. However, since I can only make it to the pub here a few hours a week for the pay-per-view game each Saturday, this forum satisfies my craving for good discussion, the rest I could do without and if I could find all your collective knowledge elsewhere without the over the top insults I'd go there.


JamesLT
April 04, 2005
DAZ: You surprise me, really. I think maybe you also failed to identify a "tone" that was essentially playful. I'd have expected that from Decaf, the Glenn Helder (no, make that Eddie McGoldrick) of the forum, but not from you, the quick-thinking Fabregas of the forum... Re: Niall's concerns about the forum, I hope there's a way to balance things out. Steve G always managed that well. Niall has a point that too much non-Arsenal debate can just end-up with the debate going around in circles, but pure football discussion can also end up being quite banal - just look at some of the other mindless message boards. For me, the only disappointing and offensive aspect of the Forum is when people repeatedly resort to bad langauge like "*llardyc*", "M**r*nh*", "Sh*r*ngh*m" or "F*rg*s*n", there must be a way of formulating sentences and encouraging debate without always resorting to such base langauge.


AmericanGooner
April 04, 2005
old man of hoy, you said a few sung Cole's name. I've never heard of a chant or song for Cole. How does it go? **** Henry is a genius without question but can show a range of emotions from moody and surly to charming and delightful when he's on the pitch. You can tell he really does want to be humble and good-spirited and liked as a person as well as a footballer but gives way to his emtions at time. A ManYoo friend I have keeps calling him a 'diva'. I couldn't disagree but the common denominators of all divas is their greatness. **** Simon, ever since JamesLT alerted me to him a couple weeks ago, I've seen in him 2 games. 1 bundesliga and an international game and I like him. He's very 'English' in his defending, if you know what I mean. **** DaveM, Wenger may be going with experienced but at least the young players are on the bench. If everyone was healthy through most of the season like last season, Cesc wouldn't have made the bench. Flamini either probably and Cygan would have gotten preference over Senderos. There wiill be substitutions and I take some solace that the youth will be getting a run out. Injuries are part of the game and there lies opportunities as well, although, I don't like to wish injury on any Arsenal players.


AmericanGooner
April 04, 2005
Agree CB, runner up and the cup would also be a good basis for next season and going into the summer. Gilberto, Sol and Senderos will be ready for the tough games ahead. All 3 will be fresh while Spuds, Everton, Chelsea and Liverpool will be on tired legs. **** babu, no way I want Bowyer. **** For a person out for 6 months, Gilberto looked good. He did exactly what his admirerers expected of him. He did add solidity to the defense. Sometimes his passing was poor but passing wasn't anything he was known for before the injury. Yes, he ducked on the goal that was conceded but Pires was more at fault than anyone else. **** I was one of the ones that wasn't a big fan of Gilberto's admittedly (and in some things I am still not), but I do admit to appreciating him more than I orignally did. Overlooking him however isn't the barometer of who knows football and who doesn't, there are many players and things that all of us miss from time to time. Even the ones that always thought Gilberto was important to the side.


Brazil 70
April 04, 2005
Daz-I think that Niall's recent post indicates that a lot of people who log onto an Arsenal supporters forum may be getting bored with the volume of non Arsenal (not even football related ) posts.For the forum to have wide appeal it must in the main deal with shared interests e.g Arsenal & Football.I do not think that those views should be regarded as trying to lecture people on what they should post.Occasional tangential issues can be entertaining but they must only be occasional, otherwise the focus of the forum changes to something more likely to appeal Philosphy students ( I presume there must already be many such sites which those who are interested can visit).Returning to football, I feel yesterdays game provided further support for the argument that the team plays better without Vieira & worse without Silva.I have to admit that is the reverse of my views of last year when I was not a fan of Silva & was worried about the prospect of Vieira leaving in the summer.It must surely be wrong to draw the conclusion that Arsenal are a more fluid attacking force when vieira is not playing & that the real defensive stalwart in the last couple of years has really been Silva? Moreover Vieira's captaincy of France has not been particularly reassuring evidence that he is the best man to lead our team. France has been struggling against some pretty weak teams recently & actually might not qualify for the world cup despite having some very good players in the team.


Daz
April 04, 2005
Oh sure, JamesLT that original "being part" of totally invalidates the main part which even I am now too E*Ging bored to repeat. And THAT's what it was all about. Actually, you're wrong and a person or thing can be part of the zeitgeist which is so E*Ging clearly what I meant but that's really enough of this. In all events, carry on with your own posts which I've always quite enjoyed - but there you go. Bourgeois North Bank? I'd be fascinated by YOUR origins, James - you don't know a E*Ging about mine but, oh yeah, I forgot, "big" words mean you're a show-off and middle-class right? Without wishing to do a Harlow I can't be arsed with people who obsess about "intellectual" posing, are utterly incapable of identifying a "tone" as being essentially playful like the dreary literal-minded E*Gers that they are and nor with the idea of threats from Niall about what he will or won't delete now that he's got his excitable little hands on the reins. And with that he sheds a small tear at the loss of his playmates and sparring partners and deletes it from his favourites. That's the great thing about the internet - and about football players when you come to think of it - blink and they're gone.


Steve Martin
April 04, 2005
Gaz, The Norwich manager, Worthington, when interview after the started with quality Team, quality players, quality club, nice to hear another manager speak the truth for a change… I imagine how it must feel for most fans of other teams leaving Highbury, due to where they are situated in the ground, the majority leave by Drayton Park, where they get a good view of home of the soon to be best club in the world… By the time next season starts, the ground will be almost built as far as the outside is concerned, only the internal building and seats to go in… Can you see the faces of Spurs, Chelsea, Man Utd, Liverpool, Newcastle fans leaving Highbury and seeing the MASSIVE structure soon to be our new home, and the fans of the lesser clubs, hoping that they soon at least have the chance to return to see the best stadium in the Country… When it is complete, Ground, House, Flats, Etc, the whole area is going to be so impressive, that Richard keys, will have enough material to dine out on for months…


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Toss-Pot team that should have read. Come on the Krauts!!!!


Cannon Balls
April 04, 2005
Jojo, get back to where you belong, which is the Chav's board, i would be supporing Martians if they were playing your tosspot team.


JamesLT
Daz, Decaf, Ch. Gooner, Steve M, Dave M
April 04, 2005
DAZ: Whatever you might say now, the fact is that you originally defined Zeitgeist wrongly as "BEING PART OF the spirit or the attitude of the time". Zeitgeist, as used in English, simply means the spirit or mood of a particular time or period, the "being part of" aspect of your definition is confusing and strictly-speaking wrong. The fact that you then refer to a dictionary definition or consult German-speaking friends to defend your position and rebutt Chocolate's argument is laughable and absurd. Never mind Zeitgeist, geistes krank would be a better description. Anyway, why even use the word if you aren't already sure of the meaning? Pretentious, toi? Poor Daz, why do you have such an overweening need to impress everyone? Yes, Daz, you're ever so, ever so, ever so clever, we all know that, now relax. Are these Chocolate-related outbursts in some way linked to your blood sugar levels? Perhaps you should avoid fizzy drinks. Talking of which, what has Daz Lite©, otherwise known as Decaf, done to offend Prof. Daz? I thought they were both joined at the lip. Reading the criticism of Daz and Decaf against Chocolate is extremely funny, if only because they's both been getting more and more desperate, while trying to appear oh so cool. Decaf seems to be slightly fainter and less distinct though, like a little echo perhaps. Unfortunately, Decaf is the bargain basement Clock End to Daz's bourgeois North Stand. However, with the Daz/Decaf alliance now split into rival factions - the People's Front of Verbal Diarrhoea and the Verbal Diarrhoea People's Front - Chocolate can now sit back and smile. Divide and rule... STEVE M: You can deservedly bask in the glory now that the majority of Gooners have finally realised what Gilberto offers the team. As so often, though few here would admit it, you were right all along. Gilberto's the most honest player at the club and I'm pleased he's even playing again after his serious injury. He deserves all the praise he's finally receiving... DAVE M: I agree with you on Wenger's preference for experienced players. You can understand it though. Managers want certainty and experienced players are ultimately more consistent - even if the likes of Senderos, Van Persie and especially Fabregas sometimes outshine their more experienced teammates. The future still looks good though. If Fabregas and Senderos keep up their form, they will eventually earn regular spots. The future belongs to them...


Daz
April 04, 2005
OK. Dem's de rules. See ya...


Daz
April 04, 2005
But there you go, Brazil 70. I didn't mind the memory lane stuff and I enjoy watching people bickering just as I like a bit of a dust-up with Harlow from time to time (sometimes literally). You've got to ask yourself two questions. Does it stop you from talking about what you want to? Are you entitled to prescribe what others should talk about. The answer to both questions is 'no' and I suspect it would have been E*Ging quiet on here otherwise. They weren't exactly queuing up with their thoughts on the points you raised were they. And for the record, there was no debate about 'philosophy' but an argument about the meaning of a word. But I get really sick of people who do the whole 'you're just trying to show you're clever' routine. Oddly, I don't need an internet forum for that I've got people around to tell me what a smartarse I am on an almost hourly basis It's just knockabout stuff so you should really save your little lectures and just talk about whatever it is that you DO find interesting.


Niall
April 04, 2005
Oh my God what a load of boring intellectual postering by a bunch of idiots - in a football forum. Almost as interesting as the sophistry debate that the same three people, with a few add-ins, subjected us to for almost a fortnight. Ok, I'm not going to delete it cos I couldn't be arsed but I may as well let you all know that the days of these "debates" on the main Arsenal Supporters Forum will be coming to an end pretty soon. I know this will be popular with some and less than popular with others, but Rob, Roger and I have plans for this website to grow beyond its current small community and hopefully attract more Arsenal supporters to the board. Discussing sophistry and zeitgeist is not going to help us do that. At the end of the day it is an Arsenal forum and not an arena for intellectual snobbery. Those who object to this and wish to have these debates, then we can discuss the value of setting up an "Off Topic Discussion" board for those who wish to discuss the meaning of German words or other topics unrelated to football. Otherwise, there is a good forum that seems to be there for you already. http://www.vocabula.com/forum/. If anyone wishes to talk to me about this my email is niall_murphy@hotmail.com.


Brazil 70
April 04, 2005
Logged on last week & was bored rigid by all the memory lane stuff about Arsenal of yesteryear blah blah.I am firmly in the look forward camp & like to discuss what just happened or what we think will happen.Nonetheless I accept that on an Arsenal supporters forum some supporters have a legitimate right to discuss their favourite teams & players from the past particularly in an international week.I simply had to read something else I found more interesting until the team played again.We have a big win yesterday,Silva returns ,Henry scores a hatrick & the team plays well without Vieira.The People runs a story about Pires & Lungberg leaving in the summer,& Manu drop points etc.Lots of stuff for Arsenal fans to debate.However you log onto the forum today & all you read is post after post of juvenile name calling & petty bitchiness dressed up as some kind of debate about philosophy.Our own low profile online version of Dyer vs Bowyer.It might be satisfying for the handful of participants but I suspect for everyone else it is pretty tedious.We all know how many people log onto this site as we have seen the tributes to S Gleiber from all over the world.I have also read articles descibing this as one of the most intelligent forums to discuss Arsenal related matters on the web.Those of you engaging in this pathetic name calling do a lot of damage to that reputation.Anyone logging on for the first time wanting to read about Arsenal related matters today will be pretty disappointed.There is a simple solution to this .If someone makes an over the top response to a football point a poster makes you either give a reasoned response or ignore it if it is purely venemous.Otherwise the bickering goes on & on (as everyone wants the last word & to get even if they feel insulted)& the Forum becomes an arena for settling personal vendettas.You cannot beat your opponent to a pulp online & physically silence him.Having said all this I have to be "big enough " to ignore any insults that come my way (from those who like to insult) as a result of these opinions.


Gaz ( B/Wood )
April 04, 2005
Afternoon all. What a thoroughly enjoyable day I had yesterday for a lot of reasons! Saw the lads play some quality football, watched the superb TH14 edge ever closer to IWWW's record, and witnessed another less-than-convincing performance from the 'Jens/Kolo/Pascal' axis! Kind of sums up our season really! Its hard to believe that its only a few years back since IWWW broke Cliff Bastins record and yet in the next 5 games it could be beaten by the best player I've ever seen at the Club. He's certainly right up there with the John Hawleys and Lee Chapmans of this world! (Only kidding of course!). I seem to say this every other week but the guys absolutely brilliant and I feel very privaledged to be watching him play for 'our' Club. As for the Captaincy it sits very comfortably with him and if PV4 does leave (I'll get to that later) I see no reason as to why he shouldnt get it full-time. As for the defence even against Norwich we looked less than comfortable and whilst I think Jens, Pascal, and Kolo are good players individually, as a trio they continue to fill me with zero confidence. Without a doubt we missed Senderos who's value to our side rose dramatically without him even playing. Was pleased to see Gilberto back but like a few others found it quite funny the reception he got. Saying that I'm not going to pretend he's been one of my favorite players as he hasn't (in the playing sense), and I've allways advocated playing Edu in front of him. I'm allowed to change my opinion though and agree that in his abscence his importance to the side was all the more notable. Its because of this that I hope that if the rumours about PV4 leaving start up in earnest again we do absolutely nothing to keep hold of him this time. I'm not prepared to go through another summer of rumours again and I'll go as far to say that if Arsene moves 'heaven and earth' to make him stay I will immidiately start questioning Arsenes ability as our manager. I'm prepared to give Arsene time to get it right as he's earned it, but I cant accept him trying to keep hold of a player again who wants to leave. I hope this doesnt happen but if it does... He's not bigger than the Club and if he wants to leave then let him go. We have a defensive midfielder in G19 (and the impressive Flamini), and if rumours about a possible change of formation up-front are corect (DB10 retireing with a more orthodox striker coming in) then our creativity will have to come from midfield, with Cesc more than capable of doing that job. So for goodness sake if PV4 wants to go lets sell him quickly and move on! As for the rest of yesterdays performances AC3 did quite well and I'm happy with todays stories suggesting he might be staying at the Club. At the end of the day he's not only world-class, but an Arsenal fan and I hope he does stay. Ralph was OK, as was RP7 and Cesc. Jose wasn't at his very best but he certainly looked far better than he did a few months ago. My only concern was that the weather was very good and his poor form coincided with winter! We cant afford to have a player who only performs in certain conditions and I still firmly believe he'll be leaving in the summer. RVP never had enough time to impress as did Clichey. Anyway, to finish on another bright note, the New Stadium was looking absolutely magnificent and it was great watching all the Norwich fans staring at it. Infact I got chatting to a few of them and took great delight in telling them all about it! Come on Arsenal.


Daz
April 04, 2005
Doubt that very much, chocolate, you E*G-end.


chocolate gooner
english'@ decaf.com
April 04, 2005
Damn… I meant ‘taught’ that will learn me


chocolate gooner
english'@ decaf.com
April 04, 2005
Damn… I meant ‘taught’ that will learn me


chocolate gooner
english'@ decaf.com
April 04, 2005
Damn… I meant ‘taught’ that will learn me


Daz
April 04, 2005
What's up, chocolate, they closing the computer room at the University of East Hertfordshire? Poor decaf - being patronised by an idiot like you is about as attractive as a big night out with Lee Bowyer.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Almost as bad a "nautically inclined", hey? Right, now ME gone, choc. xxxx. oooo. xxxx.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Nobody, Choc.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
That sounds like fun, Daz! But count me out. I go for pure philosophy rather than applied. Also, a nice wood fire, a beef curry (made by De Caf himself), several pilsners, and squabbling family await me.


chocolate gooner
April 04, 2005
Sorry Steve but I really do have to go… time flies when you’re having fun as they say but rest assured it will be just footy from me from now on… except for this marvel from Decaf… “You gone" indeed, Choco. In the circumstance, I don't blame you for scuttling off so dextrously.” … that's why I so love Decaf… dexterously scuttling?? Who thought you English? I ask you … how can you not like such a twit as Decaf?


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Choc, you said ONE of your questions. So forget the rest. I never said anything linking Schopenhaur and Geist. Gorgias made a joke, playing on "the world as will and idea", but in the same post mentioned des Cartes (and mispelling it to boot), also as a joke. Or do you think that Gorgias was trying to link des Cartes to Geist too? And why not?


Daz
April 04, 2005
I know let's combine footie and chocolate chat. Have you noticed how he's always 'cutting slack' for players like Cygan, Gilberto and Reyes. But not for Sol Campbell. I wonder why. Is it because he is English, chocolate??? He was poor against Man U but we wouldn't judge any player on one game right?


DaveM
April 04, 2005
You can see from Wenger's pre and post match comments that he really doesn't want to be playing the young players. Given a choice he'll always select the experienced ones. From next week the midfield will be Ljungberg, Gilberto, Vieira, Pires (or Reyes if Bergkamp is fit) to the end of the season. The young players have generally dropped to the bench, and when Campbell, Vieira and Bergkamp are fit there won't even be much trace of them there. This is despite the fact it's the experienced players who've let Wenger down, not the young ones. Wenger's first choice midfield will struggle against sides who pressure and tackle. Norwich didn't get a single booking, which is verging on unprofessional for a side playing us. Anyone who doesn't pick up a booking will invariably be thrashed. Yet I watched Gilberto fail to impose himself on a Southampton reserve side made up of 18 and 19 year olds who just got stuck in. I don't think we'll get enough points to finish above ManU unless someone gets injured. I just can't imagine Wenger leaving Ljungberg, Gilberto or Vieira on the bench so Cesc can play, even though we're clearly better with him in the side. The only selection I'm not certain about is at centre-back. The obvious choice is Campbell and Senderos, but although the former is guarenteed to play I won't believe Senderos will until I see him in the starting line-up. Yet I think Senderos is probably the best centre-back at the club already.


Decaf
April 04, 2005
Dyer seems to acted with uncommon good sense and to have displayed a rare public spiritedness. Bernard, sophists were philosophers, just as Fred is at nicking goals. Them's the fact, no matter how disagreeable. Choco is confusing "sophism" and the Sophists. I wonder if Choc is on his way home now ??? puffing himself up and thinking "yet again I triumph over that overeducated poseur", and chanting his motto "Commonsense, Wenger and google!"


chocolate gooner
April 04, 2005
Decaf… I’ll stay just for you if… you answer the questions. You said Kant finished the job of the sophists. I copied the post where you said it and re-posted it on here- so you can’t claim not to remember… How? By the way here’s a new question…So what’s in Phenomenology of the Mind then? … tell us. And how come you read it but can’t make yourself understood on here. It must be a miracle! Cheers.


Daz
April 04, 2005
Glad you asked, Harlow. It means the spirit of a particular age or period. So when a book for example is described as very much part of the zeitgeist it means that it is in tune with the prevailing attitude or spirit of the time. Of course, chocolate might have an alternative (and doubtless simpler) definition so why don't you ask him. Or failing that, try goonerguru.


Steve Martin
April 04, 2005
Daz, you know I do xxxxxx.... Choc, I have no beef with you or Daz, I'm just wanting a bit of footie chat, The wife and kids have gone out for the afternoon, it's on here or WBA -v- Everton, no contest, so what is a Zeitgeist!!!


Decaf
April 04, 2005
When the going gets hot, the chocolate gets melting away. I can imaging choco trying desperated to read "the phenomenology of mind" preparatory to returning to the front with honour, and saying "oh E*G" after the first paragraph. And even the prefaces is about 100 pages long!


Steve Martin
April 04, 2005
From another gooner on another web site, not me... "I've read that Dyer let down the tyres on Bowyer's car as an April Fools joke. Bowyer wasn't best pleased and told him so. Yesterday, Dyer refused to pass to Bowyer throughout the game and after one too many non-passes, Bowyer snapped.I can't vouch for the reliability of the story but it's the sort of thing that could happen" Very funny if it's true and Newcastles season could collapse because of someone letting down anothers players tyres... Still Dyer and Bowyer are what nationality, could you see the foreign players doing that, apart from Sth Americans...


Bernard
April 04, 2005
I was just wondering, does anyone have any idea whether sophists were philosophers?


Decaf
April 04, 2005
"You gone" indeed, Choco. In the circumstance, I don't blame you for scuttling off so dextrously. They only shoot people for that in wartime. It depends on the Zeitgeist.


Daz
April 04, 2005
Right, chocolate. I was completely wrong wh